If you want to build for other games

[Roger]

I just figured I'd tell ya that a lot of other level editors are hard. For example, QuArK (a multi-game level editor) is hard to use. If you want to make a simple room, you have to use six polygons. Four for the walls, one for the ceiling, and one for the floor. And you can't leave any holes. And doors are hard. You can't make a polygon and give it a "lotag." You must put an "entity" (Quake equivalent to a Duke Nukem sprite), link it to the door, and the flags are hard to place on the poly or entity as there are many. I haven't even been able to make a successful door except once by accident.

(I just felt like posting something that could be useful to some point, so don't say anything about this being stupid.)

[Usurper]

Qoole's pretty easy. If you take into account that you don't have to carve up a thousand sectors and shade every surface individually, the build time probably evens out.

[Roger]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Usurper:
Qoole's pretty easy. If you take into account that you don't have to carve up a thousand sectors and shade every surface individually, the build time probably evens out.<hr></blockquote>

Two things:
1. Quake II doesn't use sectors, it uses polygons and entities.

I saw this analogy on an FAQ:
There are two places in levels: The valid and the Void. The void is pure black and is not valid space. So, a level is like a space ship; there can be no holes or you cannot compile the level into a usable state.

2. Quoole? Heard of it. Is it easier than QuArK, or do you know? If it is, persuade me.

[Kef Nukem]

I say other build progs are hard because I've never played so much with them as with the Build of Duke Nukem. Anyway, I like Duke much more. It's quick and easy. All these OpenGL build progs suck, they're slow and you can't really test your map without leaving the program. Compiling is another thing which sucks. Why all these complicated things if we can just use BUILD images/icons/smile.gif

[cyborg]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Roger:


Two things:
1. Quake II doesn't use sectors, it uses polygons and entities.<hr></blockquote>

Usurper knows that - he's comparing QuArK with Build.


<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>
2. Quoole? Heard of it. Is it easier than QuArK, or do you know? If it is, persuade me.<hr></blockquote>

He knows how it is for him; how is he going to know whether it's easier for YOU?

[Roger]

Cyborg, good point. Even though I was tired and wasn't paying close enough attention to what he posted to see that, but good point.

Do you understand how make Quake II levels with QuArK, cyborg, or have you not tried?

[Usurper]

I pretty much used to be of the same opinion. 3D editors used to seem to take forever. I don't remember anything about quark except that I tried it once and didn't like it. I didn't like Thred or Worldcraft either, and I actually tried WC again recently--still too unwieldy. Qoole I liked. Build seems much faster at first, and it remains much faster if you don't bother to shade and detail your level, but I think that once you get used to a program it isn't much harder to model 3d levels. The fact that you don't have to mess with light and carve sectors from imaginary or guestimated light points and worry about whether your shadows are consistent helps.

What I liked about Qoole:
Decent Grid alignment (things didn't snap very well for me in WC) Easy to find all the controls + good hotkeys Good level texture preview Subtracting is painless Copies and pastes nicely Fairly easy wad management