Ubisoft still holding out against EA

[Hudson]

http://ds.ign.com/articles/620/620629p1.html?fromint=1

Way to go! http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/woot.gif

I love it when an indie company takes a stance against the media giants http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif Should provide inspiration for others not to sellout as well. EA sucks, may they burn in hell (if they don't own it already).

[Fat John]

I'm not sure how "indie" Ubisoft are, but it's good news nonetheless.

[Hudson]

Well, "indie" might be a bit far. However they do develop and publish their own games.

[thefly]

Fat John said:
I'm not sure how "indie" Ubisoft are



Yeah, that's what I was thinking. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif Is anything/everything not EA indie these days?

[Logic Bomb]

If nothing else ubi is a great brand name and it would suck to have it sucked up into the ea void.

- LB

[elloehpipati]

Anyone care to enlighten me about your seemingly unprovoked hatred against big companies like microsoft and EA? It's almost as if people bash them for the sake of bashing them. I know microsoft can be a pain sometimes, but they've always corrected them abeilt too late or too many times, but they always do. Why do you guys hate EA then?
What did EA do cept buy a few smaller companies and publishers and developers, I don't see what's wrong with that http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif they still churn out ace titles like nba street, burnout, and lotr:bfme... so why all the hate? Why would being a small company suddenly make ubisoft a favourable company all of a sudden... have you guys been to the ubi boards and see how many complains about the starforce ubi secretly slipped into their games? and shader 3.0 issues with sc:ct where in some stage fps would drop to less than a frame per second.

I know some of your hate is justified, but don't overdo it. It'll only make you blindly discriminative and foolish.

[Ronald McDonald]

EA demands that their games get rushed as quickly as possible to get the money faster http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif They also put a lot of pressure on very talented developers this way.
And most of all, they refuse to let a sequel to C&C be made (ignorant *******s) http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif

Very good and promising games have been turned to crap by the EA policy.
So....EA is death-incarnate, destroyer of worlds http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif

[elloehpipati]

Ronald McDonald said:
EA demands that their games get rushed as quickly as possible to get the money faster http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif They also put a lot of pressure on very talented developers this way.
And most of all, they refuse to let a sequel to C&C be made (ignorant *******s) http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif

Very good and promising games have been turned to crap by the EA policy.
So....EA is death-incarnate, destroyer of worlds http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif



Thanks for your input, now I can understand better the hatred for EA

[NetNessie]

Ronald McDonald said:
Very good and promising games have been turned to crap by the EA policy.




see every first person shoot ever produced by EA.

You can read about EA's inhumane employee treatement here:
http://www.livejournal.com/users/ea_spouse/274.html
with the follow-up
http://www.livejournal.com/users/ea_spouse/

[FireFly]

EA just want to milk as much money out of the franchises they own as possible with derivative zero-risk titles. Comically, they tried to cancel The Sims several times during its development - that's real vision.

We want to encourage a healthy developer - publisher model, not one where every franchise is bled dry and innovation is stifled.

[Kristian Joensen]

The ironic thing is that there is a inverse relantionship between risk and profit and since EA want zero risk, that must mean they have accept a smaller profit. Why they want do this is anyones guess.

[Soilwork]

EA are nazi's, good for them.

[Phait]

EA is a big company. Point being, in everything too much is a bad thing. Population overgrowth, too much fast food, etc. The concept applies here. They're like the Wal-Mart of developers/publishers.

[Geir]

EA, infamous but it still moves on.

[NetNessie]

Go UbiSoft for holding out!

[John]

elloehpipati said:
Anyone care to enlighten me about your seemingly unprovoked hatred against big companies like microsoft and EA? It's almost as if people bash them for the sake of bashing them. I know microsoft can be a pain sometimes, but they've always corrected them abeilt too late or too many times, but they always do. Why do you guys hate EA then?
What did EA do cept buy a few smaller companies and publishers and developers, I don't see what's wrong with that http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif they still churn out ace titles like nba street, burnout, and lotr:bfme... so why all the hate? Why would being a small company suddenly make ubisoft a favourable company all of a sudden... have you guys been to the ubi boards and see how many complains about the starforce ubi secretly slipped into their games? and shader 3.0 issues with sc:ct where in some stage fps would drop to less than a frame per second.

I know some of your hate is justified, but don't overdo it. It'll only make you blindly discriminative and foolish.



Can you give me any real differences between Madden 2004 and madden 2005? what about 2006?

[Mountain Man]

It's nice to see somebody standing up to EA, but it has to be asked, if EA did take over Ubisoft operations, would anybody really be able to tell the difference? After all, Ubisoft isn't exactly known for their high-quality products or customer service.

[ADM]

And thats why companies should never go public!

[widowmaker]

John said:
Can you give me any real differences between Madden 2004 and madden 2005? what about 2006?



The box art is different as are the CD Keys. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Back a decade ago EA was making great progress with the various sports titles. Each year getting that much better than the last. But by 1996 that all stopped. Now it is minor cosmetic changes mostly. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

[avatar_58]

Mountain Man said:
After all, Ubisoft isn't exactly known for their high-quality products or customer service.



Yeah, like my experiences trying to get tech support for XII and Splinter Cell http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif That company can go bankrupt for all I care...

[Nessus]

If the industry had a few more companies like 3Drealms who hand picked talented developers and helped them gain thier independence the whole sate of gaming would be better off.

[John]

Nessus said:
If the industry had a few more companies like 3Drealms who hand picked talented developers and helped them gain thier independence the whole sate of gaming would be better off.



Yes, but would we have anything to play? http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

(I'm just kidding! Don't attack http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif)

[Wamplet]

John said:

Yes, but would we have anything to play? http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif





Ownt.

[DudeMiester]

Ubisoft's Myst 4 games was really good, and had amazing customer support. However, you have to go to their online forums to get good support. They have employees that are dedicated to certain forums, answering questions, solving problems, etc... At least with Myst 4, those people are incredibly dedicated and helpful.

[avatar_58]

DudeMiester said:
Ubisoft's Myst 4 games was really good, and had amazing customer support. However, you have to go to their online forums to get good support. They have employees that are dedicated to certain forums, answering questions, solving problems, etc... At least with Myst 4, those people are incredibly dedicated and helpful.



Really? They must have fallen off the cart when attempting to help my problems. Instead of looking for solutions they blamed everything they could on me....in the end they finally just said "Well there isn't much we can do"

That about did it for me and that company's support.

[NutWrench]

I was under the impression that Ubisoft was mostly a publisher, not a developer. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif

[Wamplet]

NutWrench said:
I was under the impression that Ubisoft was mostly a publisher, not a developer. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif



Agreed. From what I saw, they are a mini-EA. To an extent, 3DR could be considered a mini-EA, as that is where most of their current revenue has come from.

Publisher and Developer are different things. I'd like to see someone post a list of all the games they have published AND developed. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

I have bought many games published by them and I have yet to see one programmed/developed specifically by them.

[Kristian Joensen]

Look 3D Realms [u]ISN'T</u> a publisher anymore, they [u]DIDN'T</u> publish Max Payne or Max Payne 2. They [u]AREN'T</u> publishing Prey and they [u]NEVER</u> where like modern retail publishers.

[Altered Reality]

John said:

Nessus said:
If the industry had a few more companies like 3Drealms who hand picked talented developers and helped them gain thier independence the whole sate of gaming would be better off.



Yes, but would we have anything to play? http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif



Why yes, of course we would! Look at all the high-quality third-party titles 3DRealms has produced!

[Cerberus_e]

isn't ubisoft making prince of persia themselves? I thought they both publish and make them. so they're not only publishers

[Logic Bomb]

ADoomedMarine said:
And thats why companies should never go public!



There are MANY good reasons why a company SHOULD go public.

- LB

[Mountain Man]

Kristian Joensen said:
Look 3D Realms [u]ISN'T</u> a publisher anymore, they [u]DIDN'T</u> publish Max Payne or Max Payne 2. They [u]AREN'T</u> publishing Prey and they [u]NEVER</u> were like modern retail publishers.


Dude, calm down. You're right, of course, but there's no need to shout.

[Dr. Kill]

Hudson said:
EA sucks, may they burn in hell (if they don't own it already).



Yeah, they are pretty much crap anymore. In the late 80's-1999 they were great. They released a few good games up to 2002 (or whenever NFS Hot Pursuit 2 for ps2 came out). Now all they do is rehashes of old sports series. I bought Madden 2004 for $5, and it was actually better than 2005. They got lazy. I wish they were back to how they used to be. The days of Skate or Die, Road Rash, Desert Strike, Skitchin', Mutant League football, John Madden football (the original title, before they got the nfl rights.) and PGA Tour golf before they put stupid Tiger Woods on the cover. They are just about the money now, not the quality of the games. I keep waiting for a great Road Rash rip off since EA only does shitty sports games, and Midnight Club knock offs (NFS Underground). There was one Road Rash style game supposed to come out in 03, called Jacked, but 3do went under. It looked kick ass! I hear another company bought the rights, but it probably won't come out. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

EA used to be "the little guy, and it took them 3 years of John Madden football before they could get the NFL. They had to fight hard because video games were seen as toys, and now what do they do, they screw over the other companies.

[Wamplet]

Mountain Man said:

Kristian Joensen said:
Look 3D Realms [u]ISN'T</u> a publisher anymore, they [u]DIDN'T</u> publish Max Payne or Max Payne 2. They [u]AREN'T</u> publishing Prey and they [u]NEVER</u> were like modern retail publishers.


Dude, calm down.



[u]OWNT</u>

[Reaper]

Kristian Joensen said:
The ironic thing is that there is a inverse relantionship between risk and profit and since EA want zero risk, that must mean they have accept a smaller profit. Why they want do this is anyones guess.


That is definitely not an inverse relationship. Inverse roughly means opposite, mmkay?

For it to be an inverse relationship, EA would be taking no risks and they would be making very large (or inifinite) profits.

[Kristian Joensen]

Yeah, my mistake I meant exactly the opposite.

[Jokke_r]

actually EA takes no risks yet make a huge profit since stupid idiots buy their yearly sports games over and over again even though there's no difference in the new version

[Kristian Joensen]

They aren't making huge profits currently. Here (currently.http://www.igda.org/Forums/showthread.php?postid=109370) is a link.

[Fat John]

Kristian Joensen said:
They aren't making huge profits currently. <a href="currently.http://www.igda.org/Forums/showthread.php?postid=109370" target="_blank">Here</a> is a link.



You ought to fix the URL, it gives 404!


currently.http://www.igda.org/Forums/showthread.php?postid=109370

[Roger]

I'm not one who typically goes for the childish, jealous "big companies suck because... they're big, and they suck!" routine, but well... I can't stand EA. F*ck 'em. Good job, Ubi. I tip my hat to you.

[Nacho]

I also agree and also hate EA because I like peer pressure

[DudeMiester]

Wamplet said:

NutWrench said:
I was under the impression that Ubisoft was mostly a publisher, not a developer. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif



Agreed. From what I saw, they are a mini-EA. To an extent, 3DR could be considered a mini-EA, as that is where most of their current revenue has come from.

Publisher and Developer are different things. I'd like to see someone post a list of all the games they have published AND developed. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

I have bought many games published by them and I have yet to see one programmed/developed specifically by them.



They developed Myst 4 themselves. They have studios in France, Montreal, and a few other places. I'm pretty sure the Montreal studios are the largest though.

[Mountain Man]

Although in EA's favor, Tiger Woods PGA Tour 2005 is the best golfing sim I have ever played.

[BioHazard]

Kristian Joensen said:
Look 3D Realms [u]ISN'T</u> a publisher anymore, they [u]DIDN'T</u> publish Max Payne or Max Payne 2. They [u]AREN'T</u> publishing Prey and they [u]NEVER</u> where like modern retail publishers.



No, they aren't technically publishers, but from what I understand they are acting as a sort of middle-man in between the publisher and developer, by funding a developer to make a game, in return for ownership of the IP and a chunk of the profits (correct me if I'm wrong), and letting the publisher handle the distribution. I'm not sure if that's better than a publisher-developer model.

[Kristian Joensen]

They don't get the IP, they co-owned the Max Payne IP, the only reason they own the Prey IP is becuase Prey started out as a pure 3D Realms game back in the nineties.

If Remedy wasn't working with 3D Realms on Max Payne, Take Two/Rockstar would have owned the IP from day one, without Remedy getting a share in the IP ownership at all.

Also 3D Realms doesn't rush games like a publisher, in addition to that they let the developer have considerable creative freedom.

Also 3D Realms actually funds the games as opposed to a publisher wich just provides the developer with advances.

Also working with 3D Realms enables a developer to get a much better deal from the publisher. Also there is no way the publisher can make a profit without the developer also making a profit when that developer is working with 3D Realms.

A developer working with 3D Realms gets royalties from unit one, there are no advances to recoup since 3D Realms is funding the game.

[Cerberus_e]

Hudson said:
EA sucks, may they burn in hell (if they don't own it already).



haha, funny sentence, I only notice it now http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Malgon]

Nice summation there. 3DR helps produce games, allowing developers to start out in the business. Simple. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[avatar_58]

Mountain Man said:
Although in EA's favor, Tiger Woods PGA Tour 2005 is the best golfing sim I have ever played.



I agree. I also only buy NHL games after a few years so there IS a difference between them (99, 2002, 2005)

Also, the Sims is great...I can't understand why it gets so much heat. I think its because EA milks it with their expansions..but I have a solution. Don't by them!! I don't. When I got the Sims 2 everything was brand new to me since I had only played the original and none of those money-wasting expansions.

I don't have any reasons to dislike EA except for the Ultima saga. I loved Ultima VII (both parts) and Ultima 8. Even 9 has its moments but I understand it was supposed to be so much more if EA hadn't ruined it with deadlines.

Even so, they are no worse than Vivendi, Ubisoft or any other large publisher. Business is business...

[Kristian Joensen]

Yeah, the whole game production thing is just a natural continuation of what they where doing back when they where a shareware publishers. 3D Realms/Apogee have helped at least the following developers:

Remedy Entertainment.
Id Software.
Terminal Reality.
Human Head Studios.

Not a bad list.

Hopefully the next developer who gets to become self-funding after developing a 3D Realms produced game is Ritual Entertainment.

[Malgon]

Yeah, the whole game production thing is just a natural continuation of what they where doing back when they where a shareware publishers. 3D Realms/Apogee have helped at least the following developers:

Remedy Entertainment.
Id Software.
Terminal Reality.
Human Head Studios.

Not a bad list.



Indeed. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif


Hopefully the next developer who gets to become self-funding after developing a 3D Realms produced game is Ritual Entertainment.



I am curious. Why is that? Any particular reason for Ritual Entertainment? They developed Sin right?

[Kristian Joensen]

Exactly and Levelord works there.

[Malgon]

Ah. I understand now. Levelord = http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif