How would you like the game to start?

[Halcyon]

I haven't been posting here for quite a while, but damn, i'm still waiting for Duke Forever more than for any other game. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Anyways, i was wondering, how the game will start. You know, if it will have a "right-into-your-face" intro that pushes the player straight into the action, e.g. like in Quake 4, or if it will take its time for introducing the story and the characters before the action starts, like in Half-life 2.

Personally, I would like the game to start with a lot of action and explosions. After almost nine years of waiting, all i want is simply to kick a lot of alien ass. And i really mean a whole lot. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif So, what would you prefer?

[Tim. Just Tim.]

Halcyon said:
How would you like the game to start?



Sometime soon.

[avatar_58]

"Damn....thats the last damn time those alien bastards are going to ruin my ride!"

And then the shooting begins....

[Micki!]

Something like Duke3D, or maybe you're able to play around with some stuff...
Untill Aliens arrive, and you get called by someone (General Graves..!?) to save earth...

[Cerberus_e]

I don't want the shooting to start right away, maybe start in the casino that duke owns before the invasion starts?
and as you get towards the end of the level, the windows shatter and the aliens are there http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[Mr.Sociopath]

duke masterbating in first person view.. then somekind of ninja comes out of the shadows and then duke strangle him with his mighty dick!!
and then the shooting begins http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

i vote for best idea so far...

[Wamplet]

Tim. Just Tim. said:

Halcyon said:
How would you like the game to start?



Sometime soon.



ROL

Best.Intro.Evar

[Ca Desert man]

I would have duke nukem have an orbital sky dive all the way into the city also that you have to kill aliens as you fall to your almost certain death then at the last minute you grab a jet pack or flying machine off one of those flying guys and either land land safely or just land hard and wake up in the hospital.

[Little Conqueror]

Someone else came up with this idea, so I take no credit for it, but I thought it was awesome.

You start up the game, 3D Realms logo, blah blah blah. The screen goes black, then goes back to the desktop with an error with some bogus dialog. Then, suddenly, Duke's voice says "What the hell's this shit?!?" And a mighty boot comes up and shatters your desktop, and there you are, in the action. It would only happen once, though.

[baff]

with Duke as a washed up old yesterday, drunk in a bar.
Mumbling on about how he saved the world.
ignored or laughed at by the the other patrons, until it hits the fan and then gradually sobering up and gaining co-ordination, back in the saddle for some COME BACK ACTION.

(Maybe an old Duke coin up game in the end of the bar to relive past glories and women who won't interact with him).

A mirror behind the bar. "Damn I'm looking good" followed by a lucid sober second as the real Duke comes into focus ten years older, balding and beer bellied. (like me)."damn"

[hell-angel]

I want to hear a toiler flush, duke saying "Finally I am done" and comes out of the toiler with his golden eagles in his hands and shoots a few pig cops that are out there. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/love.gif

[Cerberus_e]

Little Conqueror said:
Someone else came up with this idea, so I take no credit for it, but I thought it was awesome.

You start up the game, 3D Realms logo, blah blah blah. The screen goes black, then goes back to the desktop with an error with some bogus dialog. Then, suddenly, Duke's voice says "What the hell's this shit?!?" And a mighty boot comes up and shatters your desktop, and there you are, in the action. It would only happen once, though.



for some reason, I never liked this idea.
it's either because it's too ridiculous, because it'll give me a heart attack, or because I'm constantly going to fear that they're going to do another trick on me while playing the game, inevitably breaking the immersion because I'm constantly going to be worried.

[Zaarin]

I would like to see original way to start the game 'cos I'm getting bored in that all games start the same freaking way: little bit this and that, oh, let's let the player do some stuff, couple nonsense lines with stupid tutorials, blaah blaah, ridey, jaadajaadajaa, Action! Now, go and find yourself a weapon. No, we don't issue sidearms for noobs.

Blah! Gimme a gun and something to shoot at! We can talk bullshit after the killing!

[hell-angel]

Zaarin said:
I would like to see original way to start the game 'cos I'm getting bored in that all games start the same freaking way: little bit this and that, oh, let's let the player do some stuff, couple nonsense lines with stupid tutorials, blaah blaah, ridey, jaadajaadajaa, Action! Now, go and find yourself a weapon. No, we don't issue sidearms for noobs.

Blah! Gimme a gun and something to shoot at! We can talk bullshit after the killing!



I second this. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[Cerberus_e]

I zero that, I'm tired of first person shooters where it's all about killing, without any depth.

[hell-angel]

Cerberus_e said:
I zero that, I'm tired of first person shooters where it's all about killing, without any depth.



Well, I just like good gameplay, depth is just a bonus for me. But in this case I (and he) was refering to forced tutorials. I have been playing games for 15 years now (give or take) so I know how to play a damn game and don't need no turorial, especially if I play that game for the second time. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

I prefer an optional tutorial or make the tutorial an important part of the story.

[crunchy superman]

Right, that's why we love Duke - lots of depth! http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

[Micki!]

Who said that it would need a tutorial..?! Such stuff belongs in the manula imo...
There's nothing wrong with going around, having some fun... The only difference between the ACTUAL gameplay, is that you don't carry a gun... (or at least, you don't need it yet) That way you won't be killing any innocent people...

[hell-angel]

Micki! said:
Who said that it would need a tutorial..?! Such stuff belongs in the manula imo...
There's nothing wrong with going around, having some fun... The only difference between the ACTUAL gameplay, is that you don't carry a gun... (or at least, you don't need it yet) That way you won't be killing any innocent people...



But I hate innocent people. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Well, that can be ok, but as long as it's part of the story IMO. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif (Or something really cool is about to happen that requires this. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif )

[Micki!]

hell-angel said:

Micki! said:
Who said that it would need a tutorial..?! Such stuff belongs in the manula imo...
There's nothing wrong with going around, having some fun... The only difference between the ACTUAL gameplay, is that you don't carry a gun... (or at least, you don't need it yet) That way you won't be killing any innocent people...



But I hate innocent people. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Well, that can be ok, but as long as it's part of the story IMO. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif (Or something really cool is about to happen that requires this. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif )



Well, Prey will have it... (The bar scene) And there will also happen cool stuff... (abduction) So in DNF, i'd expect something like news on the TV, or a call for Duke somehow... Or maybe some wall simply get's blown up, and the action begins... http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/redface.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[Cerberus_e]

hell-angel said:

Cerberus_e said:
I zero that, I'm tired of first person shooters where it's all about killing, without any depth.



Well, I just like good gameplay, depth is just a bonus for me. But in this case I (and he) was refering to forced tutorials. I have been playing games for 15 years now (give or take) so I know how to play a damn game and don't need no turorial, especially if I play that game for the second time. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

I prefer an optional tutorial or make the tutorial an important part of the story.



most games allow you to turn off the tooltips.
give me a game you have issues with in that regard?

also, even with 15 years of gaming experience, without tutorials in prince of persia you're lost http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif


crunchy superman said:
Right, that's why we love Duke - lots of depth! http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif



Scott has hinted that DNF will have a good story, and that he's disappointed with the story in other FPS games.

[Halcyon]

Zaarin said:
I would like to see original way to start the game 'cos I'm getting bored in that all games start the same freaking way: little bit this and that, oh, let's let the player do some stuff, couple nonsense lines with stupid tutorials, blaah blaah, ridey, jaadajaadajaa, Action! Now, go and find yourself a weapon. No, we don't issue sidearms for noobs.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't George state once, that there won't be any tutorials in DNF? http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Besides, I totally agree with you *g*

[Cerberus_e]

no, on the contrary, he said there are probably going to be tooltips during the game when a move is first introduced.

[hell-angel]

Micki! said:
Well, Prey will have it... (The bar scene) And there will also happen cool stuff... (abduction) So in DNF, i'd expect something like news on the TV, or a call for Duke somehow... Or maybe some wall simply get's blown up, and the action begins... http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/redface.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif



But that is an important part of the story line and something cool happens, so then it's fine by me. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif


Cerberus_e said:

hell-angel said:
Well, I just like good gameplay, depth is just a bonus for me. But in this case I (and he) was refering to forced tutorials. I have been playing games for 15 years now (give or take) so I know how to play a damn game and don't need no turorial, especially if I play that game for the second time. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

I prefer an optional tutorial or make the tutorial an important part of the story.



most games allow you to turn off the tooltips.
give me a game you have issues with in that regard?




I was not refering to tooltips, but to forced tutorials, tooltips are helps messages while tutorials lead you through a certain environment and take time (well, relatively speaking that is).
But a game where I had "some" issues with it was The Elder Scrolls: Morrowind. The tutorial was forced there, but fortunately they had some character generation in there as well which really softened it all up making the problems less IMO. And I believe there was another game as well, although I can't remember the name anymore.



also, even with 15 years of gaming experience, without tutorials in prince of persia you're lost http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif




hmm, yeah true. But I am sure I can figure them out myself. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif And besides, I am refering to basic stuff like running and jumping in FPS games, POP has some more advanced fighting and wall jumping stuff, which is more complicated and might reguire some explenations. But I still prefer that to be in a seperate part of the game and not part of the main story line.


Cerberus_e said:
no, on the contrary, he said there are probably going to be tooltips during the game when a move is first introduced.



Correct. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif That way it's fine by me. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[FireFly]

I'm not sure that he specifically mentioned "tooltips". This is one of the quotes:

"We're not planning a training level, for multiple reasons. 1) We'd like to make the controls and game intuitive enough to not require it 2) It doesn't fit Duke's world to have to train him, 3) it breaks the reality of the game, imo.

I think training missions are crutches for weak design, or controls that are too complex. An action FPS game should not need a training level. Halo did it pretty well, and they trained you as part of the first level, and they made the training make sense within the game itself...that's a great way to do it."

[Cerberus_e]

from the Duke Nukem Forever FAQ:



2.29 - Will there be a set of tutorial levels like Max Payne and Half-Life?
No. New moves will most likely be introduced as the game goes on.




yes, I know that the FAQ is older than I am, but still such basic ideas can stay the same over the course of years.

[Zaarin]

Micki! said:
There's nothing wrong with going around, having some fun... The only difference between the ACTUAL gameplay, is that you don't carry a gun... (or at least, you don't need it yet) That way you won't be killing any innocent people...



Micki, they're First-Person-Shooters, not First-Person-Sightseeing. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Sightseeing is okay, when I can explore or do stuff, but ramping around narrow tube isn't my idea of fun.
And the fun part is the key, most times it isn't fun and that is what I'm talking about.

[hell-angel]

Cerberus_e said:
from the Duke Nukem Forever FAQ:



2.29 - Will there be a set of tutorial levels like Max Payne and Half-Life?
No. New moves will most likely be introduced as the game goes on.




yes, I know that the FAQ is older than I am, but still such basic ideas can stay the same over the course of years.



I think this is a good way of doing it. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Cerberus_e]

Zaarin said:

Micki! said:
There's nothing wrong with going around, having some fun... The only difference between the ACTUAL gameplay, is that you don't carry a gun... (or at least, you don't need it yet) That way you won't be killing any innocent people...



Micki, they're First-Person-Shooters, not First-Person-Sightseeing. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Sightseeing is okay, when I can explore or do stuff, but ramping around narrow tube isn't my idea of fun.
And the fun part is the key, most times it isn't fun and that is what I'm talking about.



well, but seeing an opening movie full of explosions, starting with a gun and immediately encounter enemies behind every corner until the end of the game isn't my idea of fun either http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[FireFly]

Cerberus_e said:
yes, I know that the FAQ is older than I am, but still such basic ideas can stay the same over the course of years.


I know, and that was based on an older quote which I don't think mentioned that they'd train the player using pop-up tips.

All the FAQ is saying is that they'll use some form of in-game training. This could simply involve an introductory level like Halo's (used in George's example) which gradually introduces the player to new gameplay elements, without any kind of on-screen dialog boxes.

[hell-angel]

Cerberus_e said:

Zaarin said:

Micki! said:
There's nothing wrong with going around, having some fun... The only difference between the ACTUAL gameplay, is that you don't carry a gun... (or at least, you don't need it yet) That way you won't be killing any innocent people...



Micki, they're First-Person-Shooters, not First-Person-Sightseeing. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Sightseeing is okay, when I can explore or do stuff, but ramping around narrow tube isn't my idea of fun.
And the fun part is the key, most times it isn't fun and that is what I'm talking about.



well, but seeing an opening movie full of explosions, starting with a gun and immediately encounter enemies behind every corner until the end of the game isn't my idea of fun either http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif



That all depends, if the explosions look cool, the ammo is plenty and the enemies are huge then it's cool. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif (Serious Sam 2 http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hhg.gif)

[FireFly]

I find continuous violence quickly becomes numbing.

[Zaarin]

Cerberus_e said:
well, but seeing an opening movie full of explosions, starting with a gun and immediately encounter enemies behind every corner until the end of the game isn't my idea of fun either http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif



You read only part of my last post or then just didn't understand it. I didn't say I wanted to just keep me finger pressing the trigger all the time, only then when multiple enemies attack me, after the killing cup of coffee would be nice while playing ping-pong with corpses heads or teasing strippers or doing some other stuff that isn't just walking to next target range and looking dull walls.

And the gun part, yes I want a weapon at start and why? Because everybody packs at least two arms and two legs(some guys have three http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif). It bothers me to get killed by insect that could be killed with a breathe but noo, you must find crowbar/pistol/etc. first.

[Gaut]

Duke should be sitting in a stripbar in a private room getting a lapdance and having a whiskey at his side when he hears alot of battle outside wich is aliens that have invaded.
he gets really pissed seeing all the dead chicks but he doesnt have any weapons with him so you get to kick all their arses with the mighty boot and when u get outside the bar you get up on your motorcycle ride away home and get ur old shotgun, load it and say "lets rock" and then the killing begins!

[hell-angel]

FireFly said:
I find continuous violence quickly becomes numbing.



I can agree with this. I never played SS2 for more then 2 hours in a row because it would get boring then. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif But it was a hell of a lot of fun during those two hours. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/love.gif

[Halcyon]

Zaarin said:
And the gun part, yes I want a weapon at start and why? Because everybody packs at least two arms and two legs(some guys have three http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif). It bothers me to get killed by insect that could be killed with a breathe but noo, you must find crowbar/pistol/etc. first.

Well, as long as Duke didn't loose one leg in an accident somewhen in the last few years, I think we can assume, that we can fight enemies straight from the beginning thanks to the mighty foot. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[SyntaxN]

hell-angel said:
I want to hear a toiler flush, duke saying "Finally I am done" and comes out of the toiler with his golden eagles in his hands and shoots a few pig cops that are out there. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/love.gif


But the toilet has to be in a casino..then I´m sold on the idea http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
I also want a non shooting part in the beginning, the idea with drunken Duke is also cool.

[Tim. Just Tim.]

no way, its gotta be instant action like Duke3d was. The game started with you 20 feet off the ground, having just jumped out of an exploding hover-car.

No bullshit, no walking around 'before the action'. Ive hated that kind of crap ever since Half-Life1.

If you want to mess around in a casino, and play with all the interactivity, or if you want to find toilet and take a shit, then you'll just have to kill all nearby aliens first, and then go play some blackjack or whatever.

[FireFly]

Our thoughts are that running around killing guys is the boring stuff you do in between doing cool things. It's pure filler.

Who said that?

[Kristian Joensen]

George Broussard.

[FireFly]

Now you've spoilt it.

[Kristian Joensen]

I couldn't know that.

[Kristian Joensen]

FireFly said:
Now you've spoilt it.



Could you please clean out your PM inbox ?

[Tim. Just Tim.]

FireFly said:
"Our thoughts are that running around killing guys is the boring stuff you do in between doing cool things. It's pure filler."

Who said that?




Kristian Johensen:
George Brussard.




Thats discouraging, if GB really feels that way.

[BabyFace]

Micki! said:
Who said that it would need a tutorial..?! Such stuff belongs in the manula imo...



In theory, you're right - but nobody read manuals. Take HL as an example. In that game, you have to be able to do the crouch-jump in order to reach certain places (and in one level its even critical to get through the game at all). I reckon there'd have been quite a few players who wouldn't have realized the difference between regular jump and crouching jump without the tutorial.

Ok, DNF will be different. But it may still be helpful to have a clever introduction map. It just shouldn't be too obvious.

On the other hand - maybe better - they could just offer a "training" option, separate from the game, which provides a training course for those who need it.

[hell-angel]

FireFly said:
Our thoughts are that running around killing guys is the boring stuff you do in between doing cool things. It's pure filler.

Who said that?



That is true I agree, but that doesn't mean we should be walking around with no gun, because shooting a lot of bottles or slot machines with stuff (drink or money) rolling out is fun as well IMO. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Cerberus_e]

Tim. Just Tim. said:

FireFly said:
"Our thoughts are that running around killing guys is the boring stuff you do in between doing cool things. It's pure filler."

Who said that?




Kristian Johensen:
George Brussard.




Thats discouraging, if GB really feels that way.



I also feel that way to be honest http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
if shooting is the only thing you want to do, I can recommend painkiller or one of the serious sam games.


BabyFace said:
On the other hand - maybe better - they could just offer a "training" option, separate from the game, which provides a training course for those who need it.



well, the FAQ already said "no" to that http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
and George's quote too, because a training level is undukeish

[Tim. Just Tim.]

Cerberus_e said:

Tim. Just Tim. said:

FireFly said:
"Our thoughts are that running around killing guys is the boring stuff you do in between doing cool things. It's pure filler."

Who said that?




Kristian Johensen:
George Brussard.




Thats discouraging, if GB really feels that way.



I also feel that way to be honest http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif




This is madness! What is 'cooler' than shooting and blowing shit up?!?

Flushing toilets?
Drinking from water fountains?
Microwaving Roast Beef sandwiches?

I cant believe GB and others are actually saying that shooting the mosters is "Boring filler" compared to the 'cool things'. Jesus I hope your 'cool things' are really really freeking cool.


Cerberus_e said:
if shooting is the only thing you want to do, I can recommend painkiller or one of the serious sam games.




If 'cool things' is the only thing you want to do, I can recommend something called 'real life'.
Shooting and blowing up aliens is what I need video games for, not playing pool or breaking bottles.

[Cerberus_e]

puzzle solving, environmental hazards, NPC story sequences, vehicular action, ...
of course I don't see breaking bottles as the cool shit.
if I played game only "to blow shit up" like you call it, then I'd play every game in god mode, which is boring.
also, I didn't say those cool things are the only thing I want to do... without shooting the aliens it will get repititive as well

[Tim. Just Tim.]

Cerberus_e said:
puzzle solving, environmental hazards, NPC story sequences, vehicular action, ...




Hmm, maybe I will look into Serious Sam as everyone seems to be recommending it as an alternative to DNF. The fact is I hate all of the above things you listed.

[stockboy]

I agree that puzzles suck, but I kinda dig vehicular action.

[Cerberus_e]

then try the first serious sam (serious sam: the first encounter)
I have a suspicion you'll enjoy it http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
maybe download a demo?

also, I wouldn't really call it "an alternative for DNF", the serious sam games and painkiller are just like the original DOOM: you're in an arena and tons of enemies come at you and you have those cool weapons ranging from shotguns and rocket launchers to a cannon (very fun weapon).
you kill all the enemies, then progress to the next area, and repeat.

[FireFly]

I think what George means is that what defines the game, what makes it special, is the context to the game's actions.

As I see it, the importance of games is they let us be someone else, somewhere else, for a few short hours. They provide the opportunity to become part of a completely different world - to explore, to discover, to interact - to be thrilled, surprised, shocked, awed. The act of killing an enemy provides one immediate reward, but it can't be compared to the feeling you get when you experience something new.

For example the player might be running through a skyscraper that's being blown apart and then reach a dead end: a lift shaft. On the intercom he would then hear "Duke, there's no way out this time" then there'd be a huge explosion from below. Duke: "I see you haven't met Mr. Rocket Thruster".

The player would switch to the jetpack and hit the thrust button, shooting upwards, as a huge fireball exploded up the lift shaft. Floor after floor would go by in a blur as the fireball slowly gained more and more ground, and then just as the Duke is about to be consumed he would shoot out of the building into the night air. The explosion disperses in a plume of fire, just missing the player, and then the entire skyscraper explodes from the inside, collapsing downward into a pile of smoking rubble.

Now that would be far more memorable and intense than a typical encounter with an enemy. It's about giving the player a new kind of experience rather than just throwing enemy after enemy at him. The moment people list most for being most memorable in HL2 is the simple game of 'ball' with Dog.

This is why non-combat sequences are so important.


Kristian Joensen said:
Could you please clean out your PM inbox ?


Try again.

[Cerberus_e]

I agree with what you said, and that's why I can't play serious sam longer than 30 minutes http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
and why I love no one lives forever.

[SyntaxN]

For example the player might be running through a skyscraper that's being blown apart and then reach a dead end: a lift shaft. On the intercom he would then hear "Duke, there's no way out this time" then there'd be a huge explosion from below. Duke: "I see you haven't met Mr. Rocket Thruster".

The player would switch to the jetpack and hit the thrust button, shooting upwards, as a huge fireball exploded up the lift shaft. Floor after floor would go by in a blur as the fireball slowly gained more and more ground, and then just as the Duke is about to be consumed he would shoot out of the building into the night air. The explosion disperses in a plume of fire, just missing the player, and then the entire skyscraper explodes from the inside, collapsing downward into a pile of smoking rubble.


You wrote down one of my favourite *I want that in DNF* thoughts http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Viper Knight]

FireFly quoted George Broussard as saying:
Our thoughts are that running around killing guys is the boring stuff you do in between doing cool things. It's pure filler.



That's exactly how I feel when I'm making a user level. Basically, I make levels for the player to explore and interact with. Adding in monsters into them just gives the player a purpose to play them. Also, when I'm playing someone elses user level's I'm not playing them for the action, well not primarily anyway, but mainly to see what unique designs the maker could come up with.

This is what makes games art. Going around killing things is not art. But the surroundings in which you kill things in is. A game without any art is emotionless and bland.

[Halcyon]

Viper Knight said:Going around killing things is not art. But the surroundings in which you kill things in is. A game without any art is emotionless and bland.

Exactly my oppinion. That's also the reason why No one lives forever is still one of my favourite games. And it's also the reason why I was totally bored by FEAR. I mean, the game had a great A.I. and nice graphics, but the leveldesign was imho totally boring and didn't offer anything special or memorable.
Funny that both games are made by Monolith.

[roryok]

hell-angel said:

Zaarin said:
I would like to see original way to start the game 'cos I'm getting bored in that all games start the same freaking way: little bit this and that, oh, let's let the player do some stuff, couple nonsense lines with stupid tutorials, blaah blaah, ridey, jaadajaadajaa, Action! Now, go and find yourself a weapon. No, we don't issue sidearms for noobs.

Blah! Gimme a gun and something to shoot at! We can talk bullshit after the killing!



I second this. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif



hmmm... I do hate tutorial sh!t

"You better get to the lab! Crouch under that fallen plank. Now jump over that big box. Good! Now eat this banana. Now Dance monkey, dance!"

And I also hate the cliche of always starting with a shitty weapon, or no weapon. would a guy who once had to blast his way through a horde of alien invaders really go anywhere without a gun?

But I do think that at some point he should have to rely on just a low end weapon like a pistol.

Start him off with a nice big boomstick, then have it run out of ammo.

PS: really really like that skydiving idea, maybe not for the opener but its a hell of an idea! why has it never been done?

[Parkar]

Actulay it has in nolf2. Sky diveing that is.

[Cerberus_e]

Parkar said:
Actulay it has in nolf2. Sky diveing that is.



NOLF1 http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Montykoro!]

NOLF? AKA: No one live forever?

or someting else...??


on topic...

I'd like a very simple start...

Duke and his harley...watching a sunset in las "vegas" from the desert and then a big mother ship fire a very large energy weapon on a hotel... duke said "Ok if you mess with my planet I mess your ass..." ride de harley towards the city... and Boila you start Driving the harley...

Of curse all the scene is powered By "Duke Imagen Render system" and not a FMV....

[Halcyon]

Montykoro! said:
NOLF? AKA: No one live forever?


Yepp.

[Joe Siegler]

How would you like the game to start?



Without ever crashing.

[Kristian Joensen]

Well, tell that to the programmers.

[Cerberus_e]

Yeah, won't it be a problem that the structure of the engine (even if 90% is own code) still has unreal structure, that it will be unstable? just like Valve with HL2, it isn't stable either, and they have lots of limitations, because the structure is based on (GL)Quake 1/2?
I hope that won't be a problem http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Halcyon]

Joe3DR said:

How would you like the game to start?



Without ever crashing.

That's the first thing that happened to my when I launched Half-life 2 for the first time. Quite a shock after waiting five years for a game. -__-

[Cerberus_e]

How coincidental, right after my post http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[RedSplat]

I wonder if they in some subtle or elaborate way choose to introduce Duke....Or just expect everyone to know who the man is you're playing.

And i wonder if the beginning of the game is done first.
Or if they wait until they've got 'everything' else finished — then work out the best possible start.
I believe the beginning is the most important element in a story driven game — because it's the part that determines whether the rest gets played at all. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
But why is it that more people seem to bitch about the end of a game then the beginning?

[Ivan]

RedSplat said:
And i wonder if the beginning of the game is done first.



I wouldn't see a reason why it shouldn't be done first. The beggining is part of game, and is as important as the rest of the game. If they don't creat the first levels first, at least I think they planned them meticulously.


Or if they wait until they've got 'everything' else finished — then work out the best possible start.



I hope they are working on the best possible ending. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif


I believe the beginning is the most important element in a story driven game — because it's the part that determines whether the rest gets played at all. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif



I think the most important part of the game is the ending (Like Depp would say in Secret Window, but concerning a story o/): you are playing to see the ending throughout all the game. Even if the beggining sucks, you know you are going to continue because a) you want to see the ending and b) you bought the goddamn game. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif


But why is it that more people seem to bitch about the end of a game then the beginning?



Who gives a crap about the beggining? http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[Halcyon]

Ivan said:

Who gives a crap about the beggining? http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif


Me! http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tinyted.gif
A good beginning can add so much motivation to the player. Besides, a well done beginning can stay in the memories of the players for years. The first Unreal did this very well imho.


Cerberus_e said:
How coincidental, right after my post http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

lol, now that you mention it... http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/dopefish.gif

[ZuljinRaynor]

With a huge movie saying:
"Built for GeForce 2"
so I can chuck my old card back into my computer.

[The King of Ogres]

I would really like to see that you start the game first in a building (probably Duke Burger) and you are standing infront of a window and then a few seconds later there is a flash and a Nuke goes of and Duke says

"Holy ****, those ba**ards will pay for destroying my Burgers"

Then the intro starts with Duke crawling out and being "rescued" by a team of marines or something like that http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Gatinater]

How about it starts of with Duke workin five maybe ten female pornstars in his orgy sized bed, in his penthouse. Then a loud explosions followed by tremors knocks his viagra out of the window. So he ventures outside to get more, but discovers the genocide and apocolyptic turmoil.

[Anomalous Entity]

Won't work. Far too highly-rated a scene for the game to even be considered M. That'd cause it to be an R rating in no time flat.

[Codey]

Something like this maybe:

The Nuke logo punches onto your screen, along with the familiar grabbage music (in an upgraded even more kickass form ofcourse), after which the screen goes almost completely black with only a light grey haze coming through. After while you decide to press a few buttons to see if you can make something hapen. You press the activate key amongst your random tapping and a bright horizontal slit appears and just as quickly dissapears again.
You decide to give it a few more tries and the slit widens, overbright blinding light quickly gives way to a fuzzy image and then you start to make sense of your surroundings...
There's numerous posters of scantily clad women plastered on the walls, clothes draped haphazardly over what you can only assume is furniture with the whole lot surrounded by some post-apocolyptic custom designed interior walls and fixtures.
Your view shifts as you rise from the bed and you walk over to one of the pictures, most of it is allocated to showing the beautiful blond and her material impared bikini top trying almost entirely unsuccessfully to keep her bust in check, but there is also a small part used for display of a calendar. You interact with it and flip the page over to show the next babe; December 2095, "Another day, another babe".

Your ears are being bombarded by a variety of different sounds coming from multiple directions, one of which is the sound of screams and noises through the stylish open glass doors, so you start to walk over to take a look at the larger world outside but trip over something which is catapaulted out from under the mass of clothes piled on the floor. After steadying youself you notice that it's a gold plated chaingun with a plaque on the side reading "In recognition of Duke Nukem's efforts in protecting our ".. what looks like "city" is overwritten in black texter "babes".
You continue through the open door to the balcony, your on the top floor of what seems like a 80 story skyscraper in the center of downtown Las Vagas but the screams of what could be a million people lining the streets below can easily be heard. Just then you notice there's another distinct noise coming from high above, something similar to the noise a jet would make, but much louder. You quickly look up and see the large underbelly of what you can only assume to be a massive alien ship rapidly decending and, before you know it, passed down between you and the buildings on the other side of the highway below.
You rush inside and instinctively grab the chaingun thinking perhaps by some miracle it actually works, but then you notice there's somebody standing at the door. It's a beautiful chick in a uniform that only you could have conceived in your wildest fantasy with "lady killer" enbroidered on the left lapell. "The president is arriving duke" she squeeks out, "You won't beleive the what it's like outside, they've blocked off the street, they're all waiting for you.. stop playing with that thing and get down there!"

She gives you a smirky glance out the side of her face as she leaves and slams the door shut. "I'll never get used to these puppet shows". Now the screams are louder, it's amazing even at this height they are so loud, then fireworks, boom boom, then louder, the screams are out of control now.
Then... a blinding flash... glass windows shatter in toward you and a deafening blast sweeps through throwing everything onto the wall behind you.

"That's no fireworks", you pick some glass fragments from your forearms as the blinding light is giving way to smoke and flames. "Those alien bastards are gunna pay for shooting up my town!", you rush out through the now destroyed interior door. People are coming out into the hallway until they see you weilding your gold plated chaingun and quickly retreat back to their rooms.

And so it begins....

[Cerberus_e]

ZuljinRaynor said:
With a huge movie saying:
"Built for GeForce 2"
so I can chuck my old card back into my computer.



and then in the next intro cinematic such rotating logo: "Runs best on... pentium celeron!!" http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Montykoro!]

Joe3DR said:

How would you like the game to start?



Without ever crashing.



Well if the game have a single bug... "it's not done" http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[Cerberus_e]

the patch to fix that bug would be as big as the game itself http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Montykoro!]

Cerberus_e said:
the patch to fix that bug would be as big as the game itself http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif



I HATE PATCH!

If DNF required a patch for Someting the 4 years of development (and counting...) was in vain...the game must be flawless and run "out of the box" ...

[Cerberus_e]

But if it's not released there is no "box" http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
So the patch to fix the bug that it's not released has to be as big as the game itself http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Montykoro!]

Cerberus_e said:
But if it's not released there is no "box" http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
So the patch to fix the bug that it's not released has to be as big as the game itself http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif



Ok.....is a joke...! sorry my "OS" don't process very well the "human" humor...

Of course the game was delivery via "steam" (or similar) http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

[Kristian Joensen]

Second post, third page, ignore.

[Montykoro!]

Kristian Joensen said:
Second post, third page, ignore.



WTF?

[Micki!]

Montykoro! said:

Cerberus_e said:
the patch to fix that bug would be as big as the game itself http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif



I HATE PATCH!

If DNF required a patch for Someting the 4 years of development (and counting...) was in vain...the game must be flawless and run "out of the box" ...



Some patches are good though...
Some doesn't even fix bugs at all... They just work as mini expansion packs... Like improving things, and adding more stuff (MP levels, features, STUFF) http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/redface.gif

[Montykoro!]

Micki! said:

Montykoro! said:

Cerberus_e said:
the patch to fix that bug would be as big as the game itself http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif



I HATE PATCH!

If DNF required a patch for Someting the 4 years of development (and counting...) was in vain...the game must be flawless and run "out of the box" ...



Some patches are good though...
Some doesn't even fix bugs at all... They just work as mini expansion packs... Like improving things, and adding more stuff (MP levels, features, STUFF) http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/redface.gif



Only valve in HL did that... (ricochet...and maps for team fortress) .... and Still HATE PATCH.... http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[Cerberus_e]

Monolith did that too with FEAR, adding the asylum map for halloween

[Gibaholic]

I dont care how the game starts as long as I start it with a dnf.exe.

[ZuljinRaynor]

Cerberus_e said:

ZuljinRaynor said:
With a huge movie saying:
"Built for GeForce 2"
so I can chuck my old card back into my computer.



and then in the next intro cinematic such rotating logo: "Runs best on... pentium celeron!!" http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif


http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Kristian Joensen]

Gibaholic said:
I dont care how the game starts as long as I start it with a dnf.exe.



I am sorry to disappoint you but the executable is named DukeForever.exe, as shown here (http://www.gamingisstupid.com/images/desktops/desktop_11182005.jpg) .

[Ivan]

Kristian Joensen said:

Gibaholic said:
I dont care how the game starts as long as I start it with a dnf.exe.



I am sorry to disappoint you but the executable is named DukeForever.exe, as shown here (http://www.gamingisstupid.com/images/desktops/desktop_11182005.jpg) .



Interresting. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif

Where did you get that?

[Gatinater]

Pretty good, but I still say say Duke should be the spokes person for North Star productions or some other porn studio. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Cerberus_e]

Kristian Joensen said:

Gibaholic said:
I dont care how the game starts as long as I start it with a dnf.exe.



I am sorry to disappoint you but the executable is named DukeForever.exe, as shown here (http://www.gamingisstupid.com/images/desktops/desktop_11182005.jpg) .



Poor Gibaholic, 10 years of waiting for NOTHING http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Gibaholic]

Heh, as long as its just not some electronic delivery thing like steam. Sure the updates and news stuff is nice but dont we have a homepage for that kind of stuff?

[Foppe]

I want it to start exactly as in Duke3D.
It shall look exactly as it did back then and we will play the first level.
When we finish the first level, we will see how Duke wakes up (this time rendered in the ordinary DNF engine), saying something like "damn dream, why do I always dream that?". Then he will go up, drink a glas of milk in a dirty glas, picks up a gun and goes out and shoots some aliens.

[Anomalous Entity]

The Code Guy said:

Something like this maybe:

*Words*



Perhaps, but a little too long. And chances are you'll be fighting through the start with a gold-plated pistol, not a chaingun.


Foppe said:I want it to start exactly as in Duke3D.
It shall look exactly as it did back then and we will play the first level.
When we finish the first level, we will see how Duke wakes up (this time rendered in the ordinary DNF engine), saying something like "damn dream, why do I always dream that?". Then he will go up, drink a glas of milk in a dirty glas, picks up a gun and goes out and shoots some aliens.



Probably won't happen, at least the instant fighting part anyway. 3D Realms is working very hard on the storyline and game, so instantly bang-bang-bang without any explanation is unlikely.

[Micki!]

Ivan said:

Kristian Joensen said:

Gibaholic said:
I dont care how the game starts as long as I start it with a dnf.exe.



I am sorry to disappoint you but the executable is named DukeForever.exe, as shown here (http://www.gamingisstupid.com/images/desktops/desktop_11182005.jpg) .



Interresting. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif

Where did you get that?



That's from Charlie's website Gamingisstupid.com where he sometimes changes his desktop, and shows it on the front page... It's under a section called "Desktop history"

[Denz]

Teh besterd. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/redface.gif

[HappyKing]

How would I like the game to start?

Hmmm, I want the game to start with a intro movie which makes you sit in awe for the rest of the day, no, WEEK!

[roryok]

well I know how I DON'T want it to start.

I don't want fifteen damn logo videos that can't be skipped.

I don't want to get any kind of cd/dvd drive errors, any warnings about disabling virtual drives, any of the usual copy protection crap that comes with most games

I don't want to have to connect to the f*ckin internet for four hours to authenticate the game even though all the content is on the DVD in my drive.

I don't want a really long intro video unless I can skip it.

I don't want the thing to 'auto-detect' my machine spec everytime I want to change a detail setting like FEAR does.

and most of all, I don't want to have to wait another ten years for the thing to load up

[DavoX]

The game should start with the 3d realms staff in a old people's ward, in their 90's and talking about "damn... i wish we could've finished it..." with sad music and stuff, they start to cry and then the wall explodes and duke starts shooting all the old people leaving the 3d realms staff alive and says "its time to go back in time pals" they take them to a time machine and they finish the game in the year 4054. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[hell-angel]

roryok said:
well I know how I DON'T want it to start.

I don't want fifteen damn logo videos that can't be skipped.

I don't want to get any kind of cd/dvd drive errors, any warnings about disabling virtual drives, any of the usual copy protection crap that comes with most games

I don't want to have to connect to the f*ckin internet for four hours to authenticate the game even though all the content is on the DVD in my drive.

I don't want a really long intro video unless I can skip it.

I don't want the thing to 'auto-detect' my machine spec everytime I want to change a detail setting like FEAR does.

and most of all, I don't want to have to wait another ten years for the thing to load up



I second this. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Otto von Keisinger]

Thirded, dammit. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tinyted.gif

[seregrail7]

In a bar, with strippers(ofcourse http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif). You can just walk about the place, doing whatever you like. Then a Pig Cop smashes through the bar window on his bike. Duke takes out a gun and the chaos begins.

[SLV Taxi]

Something funny happening with aliens getting Duke pissed off.

[brabee]

I just found the '01 video and watched it again... and it got me thinkink...
It looks that DNF starts somewhere in the middle of nowhere in some small village and then... maybe after saving some chicks Duke makes his way to Area 51 (might be the part with the general speaking) and then straight to Las Vegas and maybe even further.
I think it would be logical, not only if you consider locations of areas I mentined above...
Anyway, the video is almost five years old (sh*t, five years, impossible) so who knows, it may be completely changed...

[roryok]

brabee said:
I just found the '01 video and watched it again... and it got me thinkink...
It looks that DNF starts somewhere in the middle of nowhere in some small village and then... maybe after saving some chicks Duke makes his way to Area 51 (might be the part with the general speaking) and then straight to Las Vegas and maybe even further.
I think it would be logical, not only if you consider locations of areas I mentined above...
Anyway, the video is almost five years old (sh*t, five years, impossible) so who knows, it may be completely changed...



wow - five years! I can't remember what I was doing five years ago, aside from watching that trailer over and over again.

1991...


1997...


2001...

*kree*
*boom*

"I don't know how much longer I can hold this... This thing is really pissed off!"

"We're all gonna die...."

*whoosh*

*booooooom*

*brakkabrakkabrakka*

*beep... beebeeep*

"Duke, the situation has deteriorated, they have the presdent"

*splat*

"Hey pal, what're you gonna do, save the world all by yourself?"

*bambambambambambambam*

{dada daa daa dadada daa daa daa da ddda ddda daaa}

*zap*

*squelch*

"you think them glasses make you look cool or something?"

[hell-angel]

That last quote is so incredible cool. Like nothing is happening. pure brilliance. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[SLV Taxi]

Yeah save the world all by yourself one is great and it has to stay. In the E3 2001 video it appears to take place on top of the Eiffel Tower is Las Vegas which is a good starting place.

[DavoX]

SLV Taxi said:
Yeah save the world all by yourself one is great and it has to stay. In the E3 2001 video it appears to take place on top of the Eiffel Tower is Las Vegas which is a good starting place.



The woman is from lady killer, and lady killer is behind that eiffel tower http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif.

[Muskie]

---

Duke appears.

"It's Done."

*Fires rocket launcher*

Camera Follows the rocket through the Nuke symbol ala Duke3d, explodes.

DUKE NUKEM: FOREVER
---

[Anomalous Entity]

Nah, but that'd be an excellent idea for a short 10-15 second TV advertisement.

[Nadsat]

Exactly in the same place where Duke 3d started. Just for the fun. Explore the same level, with the new 3d-engine.

[Halcyon]

Nadsat said:
Exactly in the same place where Duke 3d started. Just for the fun. Explore the same level, with the ne 3d-engine.

That would be a nice idea for a demo or a bonus map. But I don't want the game to start like this.

[DavoX]

Nadsat said:
Exactly in the same place where Duke 3d started. Just for the fun. Explore the same level, with the new 3d-engine.



I didnt like hollywood holocaust that much. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif

[Malgon]

Hollywood Holocaust was great! But admittedly, I wouldn't want to start DNF like that. Maybe as a multiplayer map would be awesome. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Yatta]

IMO Far Cry has the best start. The training level isn't really a training, and you get to use a vehicle without having to get too far in to the game. In fact the first vehicle you encounter is in the second half of the "training" level. Explosions FTW.

[peoplessi]

And there are those who think these "training" levels are useless. Many of these WW2 shooters have training levels, Hidden & Dangerous 2 being a fine example how things should not be done(training level). What is there for Duke to train?

[hell-angel]

I prefer training to be seperate to the main game. But I don't need training. I am playing way to long to need training in order to learn the game. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[roryok]

hell-angel said:
I prefer training to be seperate to the main game. But I don't need training. I am playing way to long to need training in order to learn the game. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif



can we have a poll on who actually needs bloody training?

Games studios are seriously underestimating the games playing population. Did Doom need a training level? Did wolfenstein? did duke3d? did Shadow Warrior? did quake?

Training levels are for games that actually have different control schemes, such as Brothers in Arms.

[KaiserSoze]

Game starts with the screen slowly fading from black into a screen full of meqon physics boobs. Duke has woken up from a drunken stupor in a strip club. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[hell-angel]

roryok said:

hell-angel said:
I prefer training to be seperate to the main game. But I don't need training. I am playing way to long to need training in order to learn the game. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif



can we have a poll on who actually needs bloody training?

Games studios are seriously underestimating the games playing population. Did Doom need a training level? Did wolfenstein? did duke3d? did Shadow Warrior? did quake?

Training levels are for games that actually have different control schemes, such as Brothers in Arms.



I think games need some kind of short training level. Mostly for the person who play that kind of game for the first time. Also to point out the little innovations or difference that game has. Like for doom 3 (and Q4) you don't have a use key but you interact with your mouse, It will be usefull to have a training level (or message. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif ) to tell you that. It will not be needed, but it will be usefull. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif IMO that is. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[Halcyon]

I like the way Unreal 2 handled tutorials. At the beginning of the game your boss asks you if you want to do a short training or skip it. I always prefer optional tutorials, because I don't think I want to go through it again when I'm playing the game the next time.

[roryok]

Halcyon said:
I like the way Unreal 2 handled tutorials. At the beginning of the game your boss asks you if you want to do a short training or skip it. I always prefer optional tutorials, because I don't think I want to go through it again when I'm playing the game the next time.



yeah that was one of only two good things about unreal 2. The other was that S&M chick on your ship.

[Gatinater]

How about Duke is at striptech and a girl rips her bra off and Duke says "OH NO, Machinegun tits!" And the intro is a big shootout with fembot hookers and strippers.

Speaking of machinegun boobs.. remember Redneck rampage? The Vixens had machinegun boobs. And you could take then when you kill them and shoots back guys with your robotic boobs.

I think that was redneck rampage. I could be wrong.

[roryok]

Gatinater said:
How about Duke is at striptech and a girl rips her bra off and Duke says "OH NO, Machinegun tits!" And the intro is a big shootout with fembot hookers and strippers.

Speaking of machinegun boobs.. remember Redneck rampage? The Vixens had machinegun boobs. And you could take then when you kill them and shoots back guys with your robotic boobs.

I think that was redneck rampage. I could be wrong.



sounds more like a dream. A beautiful dream....

[hell-angel]

roryok said:

Gatinater said:
How about Duke is at striptech and a girl rips her bra off and Duke says "OH NO, Machinegun tits!" And the intro is a big shootout with fembot hookers and strippers.

Speaking of machinegun boobs.. remember Redneck rampage? The Vixens had machinegun boobs. And you could take then when you kill them and shoots back guys with your robotic boobs.

I think that was redneck rampage. I could be wrong.



sounds more like a dream. A beautiful dream....



I don't call girls shooting bullets from their boobs in my direction a beautiful dream. But I do know that principle is used in Austin powers. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[lamuh]

Little Conqueror said:
Someone else came up with this idea, so I take no credit for it, but I thought it was awesome.

You start up the game, 3D Realms logo, blah blah blah. The screen goes black, then goes back to the desktop with an error with some bogus dialog. Then, suddenly, Duke's voice says "What the hell's this shit?!?" And a mighty boot comes up and shatters your desktop, and there you are, in the action. It would only happen once, though.



Funny but it breaks the 4th wall. I think that something that shows Duke's humanity or lameness might be in order. Duke is not a WWF wrestler. WWF wresters are stupid. Duke is Ash from army of Darkness. Ash was a coward and silly. Everyone expects something big. Do something lame. Or you could start out with him playing a slot machine, so the first scene is a computerized slot machine screen. People would be like wtf? If they press s then they back away from the screen and there's the world. I like the World of the Worlds approach too where everything is quiet and then the most awful devastation occurs. Damn, just give me the 2001 build. That looks more fun than anything out there now.

[roryok]

lamuh said:

Little Conqueror said:
Someone else came up with this idea, so I take no credit for it, but I thought it was awesome.

You start up the game, 3D Realms logo, blah blah blah. The screen goes black, then goes back to the desktop with an error with some bogus dialog. Then, suddenly, Duke's voice says "What the hell's this shit?!?" And a mighty boot comes up and shatters your desktop, and there you are, in the action. It would only happen once, though.



Funny but it breaks the 4th wall. I think that something that shows Duke's humanity or lameness might be in order. Duke is not a WWF wrestler. WWF wresters are stupid. Duke is Ash from army of Darkness. Ash was a coward and silly. Everyone expects something big. Do something lame. Or you could start out with him playing a slot machine, so the first scene is a computerized slot machine screen. People would be like wtf? If they press s then they back away from the screen and there's the world. I like the World of the Worlds approach too where everything is quiet and then the most awful devastation occurs. Damn, just give me the 2001 build. That looks more fun than anything out there now.



I think it wouldn't necessarily break the 4th wall if it happened before the beginning of the game, as in during the 3dr / take2 logos etc but before the menu

[DavoX]

I dont care how the game starts, but i want it to end with GEORGE BROUSSARD JUMPING OFF AN AIRCRAFT and LANDING ON HARD ROCK AND DOESNT GET HURT, then he says "its time to kick ass duke!" and TAKES HIS SHOTGUN AND STARTS BLASTING ALIENS WITH YOU http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[pec]

lamuh said:
but it breaks the 4th wall.



Damn, I can't tell you how much I hate that annoying statement! http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mryuck.gif

Who the f**k cares about "4th walls"?! Who the f**k cares about whether the action breaks the boundary between the fictitious and the real world or not?!

Well, I don't. And Duke doesn't care either. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

So DNF should start like this, just to piss off all the "it breaks the 4th wall" sayers forever:

You see Duke's face fade in slowly on your screen. Then you see Duke's figure. He points a rocket launcher at you and says:

"I gonna blow a big hole through your computer screen now."

Then Duke fires a rocket and it becomes bigger and bigger on your screen. BOOM! A big explosion hits you and makes you freak out on your chair! A breaking-glass-effect appears on your screen as if your monitor broke or sth. Then the Rad logo appears and the game begins. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[roryok]

pec said:

lamuh said:
but it breaks the 4th wall.



Damn, I can't tell you how much I hate that annoying statement! http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mryuck.gif

Who the f**k cares about "4th walls" ?! I don't. And Duke doesn't care either.

DNF should start like this, just to piss off all the "it breaks the 4th wall" sayers:

You see Duke's face fade in slowly on your screen. Then you see Duke's figure. He points a rocket launcher at you and says:

"I gonna blow a big hole through your damn 4th wall now."

Then Duke fires a rocket and it becomes bigger and bigger on your screen. BOOM! A big explosion hits you and makes you freak out on your chair! The Rad logo appears.

Then the game begins.



better yet, why don't 3dr delay the game another few months and code a top secret, magic fifth wall, allowing the fourth wall to be broken all the time, without ruining the game for anyone!


shuttup - it could work.

[pec]

roryok said:
better yet, why don't 3dr delay the game another few months and code a top secret, magic fifth wall, allowing the fourth wall to be broken all the time, without ruining the game for anyone!


shuttup - it could work.



What the hell are you talking about?!

We are Duke fans! And we don't care whether the action or story breaks the "4th wall" or not. As long as the action stays dukish 3DR can break so many damn 4th walls they want! DNF is no reality simulation game where everything has to work exactly as in real life, theatre play and what not.

Always bet on 3DR! http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

I want Alien Invasion, Mighty Foot and 4th Wall Breakers! This is Duke Nukem and not real life!

Or to say it in Duke's words as he addresses the player and quotes his favorite 4th wall breaker:

"What are ye waitin' for.. Christmas?!"

http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[MetametheusX]

Start off with something slow like wandering around the world getting to know things for a specified amount of time 10 - 20 minutes with a good sized area map for wandering and meeting the hot babes you know they are going to put in. Then have all hell break loose out in the world as the Aliens Return and start a rampage. Then have the EDF (Earth Defense Force) come and try to womp the aliens as they start invading, personally I would like to see Duke Boot the EDF that couldnt aim to save his life and take his Desert Eagle and say something to him like " You should have stayed at home, this fight is for the men of the world!"
"Its time to kick ass and chew bubble gum baby!" and start blazing away.

Also I would like to see DNF like a Open-Generation map, Elder Scrolls III / Deus Ex Genre with the ability to wander and figure out better ways to move in on certain areas. That would make for the ultimate ass kicker of FPS's with few level restrictions and more than one way to get to a point.

Oh yea and access to vehicles like in GTA that would be kick ass to, to use a MotoBike and run over aliens crowding the sidewalks. "Hey Off the boardwalks pal, this is my turf!"

[laffer]

I would like for the game to start with Duke and some security guards or something doing "YMCA".. that'd be a neat opening.

[hell-angel]

MetametheusX said:
Start off with something slow like wandering around the world getting to know things for a specified amount of time 10 - 20 minutes with a good sized area map for wandering and meeting the hot babes you know they are going to put in. Then have all hell break loose out in the world as the Aliens Return and start a rampage. Then have the EDF (Earth Defense Force) come and try to womp the aliens as they start invading, personally I would like to see Duke Boot the EDF that couldnt aim to save his life and take his Desert Eagle and say something to him like " You should have stayed at home, this fight is for the men of the world!"
"Its time to kick ass and chew bubble gum baby!" and start blazing away.

Also I would like to see DNF like a Open-Generation map, Elder Scrolls III / Deus Ex Genre with the ability to wander and figure out better ways to move in on certain areas. That would make for the ultimate ass kicker of FPS's with few level restrictions and more than one way to get to a point.

Oh yea and access to vehicles like in GTA that would be kick ass to, to use a MotoBike and run over aliens crowding the sidewalks. "Hey Off the boardwalks pal, this is my turf!"



I guess that some vehicles will be in, but I doubt it (and hope it will not be ) will be like GTA.

And there will also NOT be an open ended map. It will be a game like a standard FPS setup with a lot of incredibly cool extras. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/love.gif

[Halcyon]

Yep, George said once that the game won't be "GTA-Style"
-> "I hate to possibly dissapoint you but this is how the vast majority of FPS games work, and we're no different. You're not in some amazingly huge GTA style city."

I'm glad bout that. Exploring a huge GTA-like city would just distract me from kicking alien asses. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hhg.gif

[hell-angel]

Halcyon said:
Yep, George said once that the game won't be "GTA-Style"
-> "I hate to possibly dissapoint you but this is how the vast majority of FPS games work, and we're no different. You're not in some amazingly huge GTA style city."

I'm glad bout that. Exploring a huge GTA-like city would just distract me from kicking alien asses. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/hhg.gif



Unless it's an alien city. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[DHDF]

Perhaps DNF could start something like this:

Duke, who has just completed his new book "Why I'm so great, part II", is being interviewed for national TV, when suddenly he is beamed up into an alien spacecraft, that was just passing over LA. On board of the evil spaceship, he meets his nemesis: Dr. Proton, who has formed an aliance with some space bastards to take him out and take over the world while having a cup of tea in the meantime.
They tell our Hero that his brain will be used to control the alien forces that attack earth. The result for Duke will be a long and painfull death.
Of course, Duke decides to kick those bastards. But how?
Back in his cell, he discovers they forgot to take out his mini-nucleair-blaster. And look: there's an alien armory, just outside his cell! "This is to easy...!"

http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

[hell-angel]

DHDF said:
Perhaps DNF could start something like this:

Duke, who has just completed his new book "Why I'm so great, part II", is being interviewed for national TV, when suddenly he is beamed up into an alien spacecraft, that was just passing over LA. On board of the evil spaceship, he meets his nemesis: Dr. Proton, who has formed an aliance with some space bastards to take him out and take over the world while having a cup of tea in the meantime.
They tell our Hero that his brain will be used to control the alien forces that attack earth. The result for Duke will be a long and painfull death.
Of course, Duke decides to kick those bastards. But how?
Back in his cell, he discovers they forgot to take out his mini-nucleair-blaster. And look: there's an alien armory, just outside his cell! "This is to easy...!"

http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif



That is a great idea. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
And we can use cool 256 color images and smooth sidescrolling to. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[the longest death]

the game should start like a prequel to dnf, like how he got all famous and know as the ultimate alien ass kicker. like the first 5 minutes is showing that he is watching a boxing game and aliens just crash through the roof and he attacks them. but then goes do more as he earns peoples respect ultimatly getting him to the level of ass kicker and not some dead-beet.

[the longest death]

That is a great idea. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
And we can use cool 256 color images and smooth sidescrolling to. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif


he doesnt look like a whole reader or writter guy.