Games need to be installed on consoles now?! [Archive]

Karthik

01-06-2008, 07:13 AM

So I was going through the latest preview of DMC4 and I noticed a section which caught me off guard:
The game needs to install a large chunk of files on the PS3's drive, and it takes quite a lot of time (roughly 20-30 minutes by our count). This obviously only happens the first time you play the game, but it's still quite a jarring experience to be faced with a PC-like install process on a console game.
Source (http://www.gamespot.com/ps3/action/devilmaycry4/news.html?sid=6184199&om_act=convert&om_clk=multimodule&tag=multimodule;previews;title;6)

So is the future of console gaming? Being shafted with a half an hour install screen just before starting. Before you know it, you'll be limited to playing 2 games because the HDD is full. While they are it why not make the graphics card upgradable. :doh:
Seriously, isn't the point of console gaming to be opposite of PC gaming. The way I'm looking at it feels like they are taking the PC route. I guess Kutagari wasn't joking when he said "next-gen console is like a PC" (http://www.gamespot.com/news/6152485.html?tag=result;title;7) along with Phil Harrison ranting "The PS3 is a PC" (http://www.gamespot.com/news/6152133.html).

mistar intarnet

01-06-2008, 07:16 AM

Yeah, but so far I have only seen this on PS3 titles. For instance, Heavenly Sword needs to install a whooping 1,7gb on the hdd :eek:

Sang

01-06-2008, 07:20 AM

Hehe, now it's the PC gamers' turn to point and laugh! ;)

Karthik

01-06-2008, 07:24 AM

I also heard that Ridge Racer has an installation as well.

mistar intarnet

01-06-2008, 07:27 AM

Hehe, now it's the PC gamers' turn to point and laugh! ;)

You can point and laugh when console gamers need to spend 30 minutes searching for drivers, patches and screwing around with the settings and config files to even get their games to run ;)

Dave-ros

01-06-2008, 07:47 AM

This puts a new spin on Sony's claim in 2006 that the PS3 would make PCs obsolete :D

Pontiaction

01-06-2008, 09:43 AM

I saw this with Heavenly Sword as well. I was blown away when the game started "installing" (on a console?!) and took nearly 15 minutes to finish. I actually popped in the game disc, saw what was going on and went away to do something else for a while.

This is the only thing about the PS3 which really irritates me, it seems absurd that this is necessary. But perhaps it needs to offload textures or resources to the HDD because the game would need to access them too quickly for the optical drive to deliver in a timely manner.

At least, once the game is installed, you don't have to deal with that long wait again. But I guess this is one reason why the PS3's hard drive is so much bigger than the 360's! :)

Denz

01-06-2008, 09:46 AM

Dave-ros

01-06-2008, 09:47 AM

Is this related to how it (allegedly) takes Blu-ray discs 3 minutes to start?

superevilcube

01-06-2008, 09:53 AM

The Ridge Racer install is optional, but I think the reason they do it is to increase load times.

Games certainly don't take 3 minutes to start up and neither do my Blu-Ray movies (on my PS3 at least). I've heard of them taking forver to start up on some stand-alone players, though.

I know Warhawk has to be installed 100%, but that's only so the load times are the same for the people who downloaded it and bought it retail.

Bludd

01-06-2008, 10:06 AM

At least every PS3 has an HDD.

Karthik

01-06-2008, 10:17 AM

I won't be surprised if the successor to PS3 will dump the whole game onto the HDD and use the disc as a dongle.

ZuljinRaynor

01-06-2008, 10:17 AM

I have one comment for this.

:nelson:

CommanderZx2

01-06-2008, 10:22 AM

You can point and laugh when console gamers need to spend 30 minutes searching for drivers, patches and screwing around with the settings and config files to even get their games to run ;)

You don't need new drivers with every game, besides if it takes you that long to find drivers perhaps you should just stick to consoles.

Altering settings is optional, any game on the PC will run without you altering the graphics settings.

ADM

01-06-2008, 10:27 AM

At least every PS3 has an HDD.

But imo that's a good thing for the 360 now since developers will have to make their load times quick while buffering straight off the DVD.

I don't want to have to install games on my console.. I want to have quick gaming sessions without the hassle of having to have free space on my hard drive.

Bludd

01-06-2008, 11:29 AM

But there's a limit to what you can stuff into the main memory or the flash cards.

Streaming content is good, but streaming from the HDD will be better than streaming from the DVD. You can stream at a maximum rate of about 16.62 MB/s from the 12x DVD drive in the Xbox 360, 9 MB/s from the 2x BD drive in the PS3 and with 2.5" HDD you can get up to almost 30-50 MB/s in read performance.

Boo Boo Juice

01-06-2008, 11:56 AM

This news is new? Almost all ps3 games can be installed. The thing that is different about Devil May Cry 4 is that you are REQUIRED to install the game. You have no choice in the matter. Most games give you the option to install the game.

Its still quite different than installing a PC game though, I think. This installs just a small portion of game data so that it just helps decrease load times (or in DMC4's case gets rid of them entirely). Although, in DMC4's case I don't consider five gigs to be a small portion :P

Danule

01-06-2008, 12:42 PM

Kennerado

01-06-2008, 05:31 PM

There have been times when patches have been released, Assassin's Creed is one example.

Dr. Kill

01-06-2008, 06:22 PM

Well that's just pathetic. The games are on Blu-Ray, which holds 50GB... WHY MUST THERE BE AN INSTALL?! :confused:

If things go this way, I'll have to say console gaming is dead. If I have to INSTALL a freakin game, I might as well just upgrade my pc instead of buy consoles.

Ahhh... thinking back, we had it SO GOOD in the NES days. You take the NES, you plug it in, you hook it to the tv, plug in the controllers, pop the game in, and turn it on. Then maybe turn it off wiggle the game around a bit if you get the flashy screen, turn it back on, and you're playing the game. ;) I used to HATE havin to mess with the carts to get them to work, but I'd rather do that than INSTALL A CONSOLE GAME! :doh: "WHAT were they THINKING?!" - AVGN

Now I'm nervous every time I turn on my 360, HOPING it will work.

Edit:

I have no problem with game patches on consoles. In fact, I think it's necessary. But an install?! WTF?!

Echo Black

01-06-2008, 08:22 PM

Steve

01-06-2008, 08:24 PM

Yet, no PC game ever took me over 10 min to install. It's usually way faster than that.

Try installing Gears of War :o

Mr_Diffrence

01-06-2008, 08:52 PM

Console games are going through the patch woes as well. I had a feeling this was going to happen when online connectivity for consoles became more prevalent. The only problem is that console patching has go through the console manufactures QA process which could take several weeks compared to a PC game patch can be released immediately to the public from the developer.

Todays consoles are more like Macs than PCs; locked down hardware specs and locked down software specs. At least on Macs developers don't have to bend over to a publisher or console manufacture to get their game running on the platform.

Echo Black

01-06-2008, 08:59 PM

Try installing Gears of War :o

Didn't take that long. COD4 took me longer, and I doubt it took 10 min.

Steve

01-06-2008, 09:00 PM

Didn't take that long. COD4 took me longer, and I doubt it took 10 min.

It took 20 min for me! :eek:

Karthik

01-06-2008, 10:14 PM

Try installing Gears of War :o
No kidding. I never understood why they had to decompress the data on th HDD when they could have saved time by decompressing while coping to the HDD like how Marvel Ultimate Alliance does.

Dr. Kill

01-06-2008, 10:21 PM

Steve

01-06-2008, 10:22 PM

Personally, I don't mind long install times that much. I pop the game in, hit install, and grab a few brews. The thing I HATE is games with multiple CD's! :mad: Riddick has FIVE! I HATE switching them out. Two discs, ok. Three discs, that's pushin it. But FIVE?! God DAMN!

Yeah, I do the same :) ... I think Doom 3 has about 3 or 4. Can't remember but it pissed me off :D

Karthik

01-07-2008, 02:17 AM

Personally, I don't mind long install times that much. I pop the game in, hit install, and grab a few brews. The thing I HATE is games with multiple CD's! :mad: Riddick has FIVE! I HATE switching them out. Two discs, ok. Three discs, that's pushin it. But FIVE?! God DAMN!
Most of the games today come on DVD and you can even pay and download on the spot. Very few games today are released on CD. The last being SunAge I think.

Yatta

01-07-2008, 03:01 AM

Ted Games need to be installed on consoles now?!
Looks like Sony just keeps making the PS3 appear more and more lame.

Hudson

01-08-2008, 07:29 AM

The 360 does the same exact thing, it decreases load times. If you have Rainbow 6 Vegas for the 360 it installs 1.5gb of data to your HDD.

This isn't a Sony-exclusive thing :p

Karthik

01-08-2008, 07:53 AM

While we are at it, does the Wii allow you to install on SD cards as well?

Twin

01-08-2008, 09:10 AM

i was quite shocked when i first started up my PS3 and put heavenly sword in only to have it install... not only that but i also find that most ps3 games have a load of updates. I just got eye of judgement (which is f'ing AWESOME btw! :D ) and i had to do 3 updates on my ps3 just to play the game :p

Pontiaction

01-08-2008, 11:57 AM

The 360 does the same exact thing, it decreases load times. If you have Rainbow 6 Vegas for the 360 it installs 1.5gb of data to your HDD.But in that case, IIRC, the game handled the operation transparently and quickly enough that the end user never needed to be bothered with the process whatsoever.

Longtimefan1984

01-08-2008, 12:13 PM

Yeah, i have Rainbox six on the 360 i don't even remember installing a 1.5Gb file:confused:

slapnutz

01-08-2008, 05:31 PM

So can anyone indicate what the loading difference is btw DMC4 on the PS3 and Xbox360?

It would be quite interesting to see how a HDD-less Xbox360 compares with a PS3 when playing/loading bits in DMC4.

..is this game already out?

Water12356

01-08-2008, 05:36 PM

Devil May Cry 4? Not out till Febuary.

Damien_Azreal

01-08-2008, 05:38 PM

Try installing Gears of War :o

No kidding. :p I honestly started the install, went to the bathroom, got a drink and food... surfed TV and then came back and it was still installing. :doh:

The install itself was fine... but decompressing the files was just... wow.

ZuljinRaynor

01-08-2008, 05:41 PM

The 360 calls it "cache" and the last three games I believe you play are stored in this cache. These are the gigabytes that you don't see on your 360, the system files. Patches are also stored here I think. So if you clear the cache, you clear the patches. This is why the last three games you play load up faster, they're on the 360 already.

Dr. Kill

01-08-2008, 07:00 PM

I bet GTA IV will do this installing crap, too.

Steve

01-08-2008, 07:15 PM

I bet GTA IV will do this installing crap, too.

I have no problem with installing games on a console. :confused:

ZuljinRaynor

01-08-2008, 07:29 PM

Did you get an Elite, Steve?

Steve

01-08-2008, 09:06 PM

Did you get an Elite, Steve?

Indeed I did.

ZuljinRaynor

01-08-2008, 09:17 PM

Indeed I did.

I can see why you don't care. :D
(I got an Elite myself too.)

Yatta

01-08-2008, 09:26 PM

The 360 does the same exact thing, it decreases load times. If you have Rainbow 6 Vegas for the 360 it installs 1.5gb of data to your HDD.

This isn't a Sony-exclusive thing :p
Right, but the regular 360 doesn't come with a hard drive, so it's not a requirement on the 360.

Since the PS3 comes with a hard drive, I don't think owners for the game in question would have a choice.

Steve

01-08-2008, 09:33 PM

I can see why you don't care. :D

Yup. Although I don't know why people bitch about the PS3 doing it as you can just slap a larger laptop hard drive in and away you go. It's different for 360 owners, however, as the hard drives are f*ucking expensive :o

ZuljinRaynor

01-08-2008, 09:35 PM

Right, but the regular 360 doesn't come with a hard drive, so it's not a requirement on the 360.

Since the PS3 comes with a hard drive, I don't think owners for the game in question would have a choice.

Yeah, the HDD-less 360 has longer loading times because it doesn't have the cache space.

Dr. Kill

01-08-2008, 11:18 PM

I can see why you don't care. :D
(I got an Elite myself too.)

I, on the other hand, have a (so called) "premium", with only 1.5GB left, and that's without any demos installed. :(

Microsoft REALLY screwed me over.

Mr.Fibbles

01-08-2008, 11:55 PM

Maybe they should work on making faster discs that they store the game on so you don't have to install. Maybe they should try going back to cartridges or something.

Either way, it doesn't matter that much to me since I am an almost PC exclusive user. If I wasn't a poor college student, I would get a Wii because it has things I can't get for PC.

ZuljinRaynor

01-09-2008, 03:03 PM

I, on the other hand, have a (so called) "premium", with only 1.5GB left, and that's without any demos installed. :(

Microsoft REALLY screwed me over.

Well, the 20GB HDD they give you, you can only use like 13GB. The other 7 GB are for the cache and stuff. You can't use those, and that's where games get installed.

But if it's a choice of install or needs more stuff to install, then yeah, you're screwed.

8IronBob

01-09-2008, 03:20 PM

Well, I can see that 40GB on the PS3 ain't gonna get the job done, but I can probably find a nice cheap laptop drive that will probably triple or quadruple that capacity. Right now, with the PS3 OS, and the formatting, it's around 31GB or so. So, I can see that if I can grab a nice 160GB or higher HDD from Newegg for around the maximum price of $120 or so, I'll be good to go.

Well, this 160GB for $85 will get the job done. Coincidentally, it's a Toshiba drive...
Bum...bum...buuuuummmmmmm... http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductReview.aspx?Item=N82E16822149058

Might as well find myself a hard drive enclosure for the 40GB HDD and recycle that for PC backups.