Is there a proper widescreen hack yet?

[Blue Lightning]

i brought this up some time ago, but I hope enough time has gone by and mabey something is being done. I want to get a widescreen, I really do. What's holding me back at this point is Duke Nukem 3D.

As you know, running Duke in widescreen gives you a stretched image which isnt a proper hack. It makes duke too short, and you really notice it when you look down (he's too short anyway, but every FPS seems to have that issue).

Anyway, I was wondering if the team has been talking about a proper WS, or even if it is possible?

Thanks.

[Dopefish7590]

try selecting "widescreen" in the video options :p

it fixes this

[Blue Lightning]

Not really.

Last time I tried (3 month ago), it simply stretchs the screen. If you compare WS Duke next to a regular square monitor of Duke, you will notice that the images on the WS Duke are wider and fatter. So it's a stretched FOV, not a "proper" widescreen.

EDIT: I think for it to work right in WS, content has to be added on the right and left sides of the screen...content that you wouldn't of seen normally unless you turned slightly to the left or right.

[Daedolon]

Streched FOV is proper widescreen :doh:

EDIT: I think for it to work right, content has to be added on the right and left sides of the screen...content that you wouldn't of seen normally unless you turned slightly to the left or right.

Click the option on and off for several times, you should notice that you DO see more on the left and right.

[Dopefish7590]

actually it increases your feild of veiw and makes things narrower, it stretches your veiw so its at a 16:9 aspect ratio

[Blue Lightning]

No it doesn't

I was starring at a fat pipebomb that I was holding, and comparing it to my 5:4 monitor right next to me where the pipebomb looked normal. So again, with WS the image is stretched. Note I was careful this time to say image instead of FOV.

Now if this has been updated in the last three months, then sorry for the fuss. I have a feeling it has not though. Yes I notice these details which is annoying but helpful I hope. Those with WS are looking at fatter images because the image has to be stretched to fill the widescreen. If you already didn't know, sorry I had to break it to ya.

EDIT: How is a proper widescreen image attained? Will code have to be added to nearly every line? Just wondering.

[Daedolon]

The pipebomb might be cause because of the HDR pack if you're using it, but other than that, I don't see any problems:

WITHOUT Widescreen mode:
http://kotisivu.suomi.net/daedolon/duke0001.jpg

With Widescreen mode:
http://kotisivu.suomi.net/daedolon/duke0002.jpg

[Blue Lightning]

Your joking right? Both of those are WS mode!

Look how fat everything looks. Should I take some screenies and post them?

[Daedolon]

I'm not going that way anymore, if you refuse to see it, then it's your problem.

[Blue Lightning]

I'm not the one refusing to see things. Here is how it is supposed to look.

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i139/realknight34/eduke322008-02-0310-14-00-93.jpg

As you can see when compared to yours, This shot from my 5:4 screen shows the images the way they are intended to be. Your image is stretched. Mine looks as it did originally. Look at the HUD boxes, these are normal, and yours are stretched. Look at the pipebomb. Look at everything!

Here it is using the HRP:
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i139/realknight34/eduke322008-02-0223-00-36-37.jpg

[Daedolon]

Here is how it is supposed to look.

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i139/realknight34/eduke322008-02-0223-00-36-37.jpg

I thought you were talking about widescreen, which is either 16:10 or 16:9, your picture is 5:4 which is NOT widescreen.

As you can see when compared to yours, your image is stretched. Mine looks as it did originally. Look at the HUD boxes, yours are stretched. Look at the pipebomb. Look at everything!

Yes, there widescreen code in Eduke32 does NOT apply the new widescreen FOV to the HUD, AND it only works for resolutions of 16:10. But everything else it renders are perfectly fitted to a widescreen resolution/monitor.


EDIT: Also:
Your joking right? Both of those are WS mode!

I hope you're not confusing "widescreen resolution" to "widescreen mode". The first screenshot has a resolution of 1440x900 but a 4:3 image stretched on the 16:10 viewplane. The second has a 1440x900 resolution with a 16:10 image fitted perfectly on the 16:10 viewplane.

[Blue Lightning]

I thought you were talking about widescreen, which is either 16:10 or 16:9, your picture is 5:4 which is NOT widescreen.

Yes in my OP I say I have a regular square 5:4 and won't get a WS until Duke 3D suports a proper WS image. So the image I am showing above is from a "square screen" 5:4.

I hope you're not confusing "widescreen resolution" to "widescreen mode". The first screenshot has a resolution of 1440x900 but a 4:3 image stretched on the 16:10 viewplane. The second has a 1440x900 resolution with a 16:10 image fitted perfectly on the 16:10 viewplane.

I don't know the difference or even what your saying. All I am saying is your two "rectangale" type screens (which in both cases are WIDE screens to me) show a stretched image compared to my square LCD screen. That's what I'm talking about...when (if) will that get fixed?



Yes, there widescreen code in Eduke32 does NOT apply the new widescreen FOV to the HUD, AND it only works for resolutions of 16:10. But everything else it renders are perfectly fitted to a widescreen resolution/monitor.

Ok, so I guess my question remains: Will EDuke 32 apply the new widescreen FOV and HUD? My next question is: are you sure that it renders everything correctly for 16:10? I think my WS on my laptop (which is my other computer that I have here) is 16:10 and it looks stretched still, and Duke seems shorter than normal.

[Daedolon]

My next question is: are you sure that it renders everything correctly for 16:10?

I think TerminX can answer that with certainty.

[Blue Lightning]

I think TerminX can answer that with certainty.

Oh TerminX, where art thou? :-D

EDIT: I hate to say it, but those with WS are not seeing DN3D in it's original form. The same problem occurs with other older games too, most games from "Call of Duty UO" and before, either do not support a TRUE widescreen image, or if they do, only in a low resolution. This is why I will not buy a Widescreen monitor for my PC...I love my old games the way they were intended to be seen.

I think that the HRP and EDuke team has done wonders...they saved DN3D and made it playable and beautiful for future generations to enjoy, but future generations should see and play the game with it's images properly rendered. I'm sure everyone would agree with that.

So TermnX, can this be accomplished? And if so will it be accomplished? And if it is a big job but can be done, how can I help?

[ZuljinRaynor]

The pipebomb might be cause because of the HDR pack if you're using it, but other than that, I don't see any problems:

WITHOUT Widescreen mode:
http://kotisivu.suomi.net/daedolon/duke0001.jpg

With Widescreen mode:
http://kotisivu.suomi.net/daedolon/duke0002.jpg

There is a clear difference in these. Just look at Duke in both for the clearest difference.

Good comparison shots.

[Blue Lightning]

Compare with a 5:4 shot below

[Blue Lightning]

Yes but compare both of those to my 5:4 shot

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i139/realknight34/eduke322008-02-0310-14-00-93.jpg

See how skinny my pipbomb is? Count the tiles my pipebomb covers going accross from the mirror. My bomb covers only 4 and 1/2 tiles accross. His is a full 6 tiles wide! (were standing in almost the exact same spot, so the "tile measurment would be close to accurate).

[Usurper]

WTF do you want? Black bars on your weirdass monitor? You don't make any sense.

[Hudson]

Indeed..

[Blue Lightning]

Bah

You dont understand anything about true WS image. Forget it.

[Dopefish7590]

we do, i have a ws monitor and found it stupid how it stretches at 4:3 resolutions... its just what wer said fixed it, really, its true widescreen, trust me... maybe you played duke in widescreen on a 4:3 monitor so duke looked skinnier, so the normal duke looks weird to you

[eyceguy]

Hey BL, I think i see what you are talking about, and I *think* I also see where all the confusion is.

The basic question is Are you using the polymost renderer or the classic?

Now WS seems to only show up as an option when using the polymost renderer. The classic renderer does not seem to support WS, but fakes it by stretching.

Now by the screenies you submitted I'm assuming you are using the classic renderer

There is a difference with WS Mode and WS Res.
Res is just taking a 4:3 image and stretching it to fill a 16:9 viewspace.
Mode says that we can draw a little bit more from the left and right to get our 16:9 viewspace which avoids the actual stretching.

I tried switching on and off widescreen while in polymost and it did seem to actually draw more on the sides

Now while in classic, since i could not switch widescreen I just changed the screen size to a WS res (640x400 for my test case) and there i did have some noticeable stretching.

So my response would be if you want true WS use the polymost renderer and then switch on the WS option

[Blue Lightning]

Hey BL, I think i see what you are talking about, and I *think* I also see where all the confusion is.

The basic question is Are you using the polymost renderer or the classic?

Well, for purposes of a demonstration I used classic 8 bit in my first SS above, and the second SS I used 32 bit polymost which includes the HRP, as I illustrated. Both ways it didn't matter. The reason the first SS was 8 bit classic, is I was comparing the screenie to Daedolon screenshot, which also appeared to be in classic (though strangley with better gfx than 8 bit). Are you saying I can have polymost renderer, but without the HRP? I never knew that.


Anyway, I doesnt matter. As you can see above from Daedolons screenshot, his HUD and weapon (at the very least) is stretched too wide. It does not make a difference about 8 bit or 32 bit, or anything else.

WTF do you want? Black bars on your weirdass monitor? You don't make any sense.

No, not really. I wanted to point out that the widescreen mode for DN3D is flawed. I personally don't care that much, scince I'll be keeping my 19 inch square monitor for quite some time so I can enjoy CoD and RTCW and other games that don't do well in WS. I just wanted to make sure that the team knows the flaw, so they can one day fix it.

[NabbyFan]

How is it flawed? You're trying to enable widescreen mode while the game's set to 1280x1024, a non-widescreen resolution. If you want proper widescreen support, set the in-game resolution to one that's a widescreen resolution (in your case, 1280x800 would work).

EDIT: If you're complaining about the HUD and the model being stretched in widescreen, that's the actual normal behavior. If you remember your last thread (http://forums.3drealms.com/vb/showthread.php?t=27559&highlight=widescreen) about this issue, Daedolon pointed out that the game was originally developed for 320x200 resolution, which is a smaller version of today's widescreen resolutions. The artwork for the weapons and the HUD were optmized for a 320x200 display, and the high-res sprites were set to the same resolution as those art pieces. When you view those on your 5:4 screen, they're actually being squished to fit your screen. It's with widescreen resolutions that the HUD and weapon sprites are being displayed properly, not the square 4:3/5:4 resolutions.

[Usurper]

I find it completely bizarre that somebody without a widescreen monitor is complaining about the widescreen mode not being up to their high personal standard. :rolleyes: Those of us with widescreen monitors know that it's fine.

[Steve]

Okay, wtf? He is running the widescreen option on a non widescreen monitor and complaining about it? Wow... :o

[Dopefish7590]

OMG! Blue Lightning, you honestly when off the deep end this time. Why would you even complain about widescreen mode when you dont have a widescreen monitor to see that it works... The reason why your other games look weird in widescreen mode is becuase you dont have a widescreen monitor, really dude...

[Radar1013]

I reread this whole thread. And it's still funny the second time! I don't understand why Blue Lightning keeps talking when not ONE person is on his side.

It's sorta pathetic though. When is he going to accept the fact that he's obviously wrong. I mean, c'mon! He's complaining about widescreen looking screwed up when he doesn't even have a widescreen moniter! It can't get more pathetic then that!

Well, maybe with him it can get more pathetic.:insomnia::rolleyes:

[Dopefish7590]

Removed due to TerminX's thought on my idea... Could a moderator please delete this post?

[Radar1013]

Ha Ha! Nice!

Also, how did you add a tag?

[Dopefish7590]

The "Edit Tags" button at the right side of the screen in the "Tags" window just above the "Quick Reply" window. Sorry to those who read my last post as flaming, but this thread really just...

[Steve]

Added a new thread tag "APBLT" im going to add this tag to any threads I consider to be "Another Pointless Blue Lightning Thread". (APBLT) Not all of his threads were pointless, but really, Im not going to reply on any other threads like this that become falmebait, I'm going to try to reduce this with the thread tags.

Put the guy on ignore like I have done. He's full of it and the ignore feature helps ;)

[Radar1013]

Put the guy on ignore like I have done. He's full of it and the ignore feature helps ;)

I won't. I like a laugh every now and then.:D

[Steve]

I won't. I like a laugh every now and then.:D

It got to the point where I thought his comments were just taking the piss... but he's actually serious :o

[Dopefish7590]

Edited out due to "mean-spirited" stuff.

[Usurper]

Eh, this is starting to get mean-spirited.

[The Commander]

I can see this will be deleted pretty soon.

[Dopefish7590]

... ;) ...

[TerminX]

Do not add inflammatory tags to threads. Widescreen mode is a hack... the FOV in Polymost was lowered a while back to try and hide some of the hall-of-mirrors problems that happen when looking too far up and down; widescreen mode just changes the FOV hack to only apply vertically. Everything is indeed rendered in 16:10, however, so it's still technically widescreen.

[Dopefish7590]

I hear you... I guess the "APBLT" tag plan should stop. I will remove it from the threads I have added it to.

[Blue Lightning]

Okay, wtf? He is running the widescreen option on a non widescreen monitor and complaining about it? Wow... :o

Huh? What are you talking about? Who said I was running a widescreen option on a non-widescreen monitor? Where did you get that from?

OMG! Blue Lightning, you honestly when off the deep end this time. Why would you even complain about widescreen mode when you dont have a widescreen monitor to see that it works... The reason why your other games look weird in widescreen mode is becuase you dont have a widescreen monitor, really dude...

Umm, if you read one of my above posts, you would see that I do indeed have a widescreen monitor...on my other computer which is a laptop. So I guess you missed that one. Behold:
I think my WS on my laptop (which is my other computer that I have here) is 16:10 and it looks stretched still, and Duke seems shorter than normal.



*sigh* :rolleyes: Look, I don't buy that DN3D originaly was made for a low res widescreen, (320 X 200), and that all of these years with 4:3 and 5:4 screens, the images have been too skinny...I really can't buy that at all, espicially since nobody had a widescreen in 1996...everyone had 4:3! Mabey they did have a low res WS mode in 1996, and if so, I'm sure it shows the same images dimentionaly on HUD, as does the 4:3. That would be a proper hack.

the FOV in Polymost was lowered a while back to try and hide some of the hall-of-mirrors problems that happen when looking too far up and down; widescreen mode just changes the FOV hack to only apply vertically. Everything is indeed rendered in 16:10, however, so it's still technically widescreen.

You see folks? I was right after all...it is a good image in WS, but it isn't a "proper hack" if you know what I mean. The HUD and weapon you hold appear a little wide when compared to a 4:3 image. TerminX just explained it.


So Steve, and Radar and Dopefish and Usurper (the one's who laughed at me), do you now understand, or do you need it in big bold letters?

[NabbyFan]

Then you should've said it was just the HUD being stretched. Using this small detail to say widescreen support is broken when in actuality it works for everything except the HUD is blowing things out of proportion.

As far as I care, as long as the rest of the game itself is widescreen, the HUD stretching is no big deal.

[Radar1013]

We knew since the beginning it was a hack! And it is proper widesreen except for the stetched HUD stuff. We thought you were complaining about everything looking messed up because if this:

As you can see when compared to yours, This shot from my 5:4 screen shows the images the way they are intended to be. Your image is stretched. Mine looks as it did originally. Look at the HUD boxes, these are normal, and yours are stretched. Look at the pipebomb. Look at everything!

When you said "look at everything" we took that as if you were complaining about everything looking messed up.

If we misunderstood you, then it's your own fault.

[Dopefish7590]

You should've clarified dude. Sorry we misunderstood.

[Blue Lightning]

No prob, but even though it is the HUD and the weapon you hold that is a bit stretched, I was asking if the rest of the image might...and I say MIGHT be a little off as well. Mabey it's not and just feels that way because of the HUD and weapon, but looking down at the floor in the game, I (Duke) feel a bit shorter. Again, that might just be an illusion because of HUD/Weapon.

But the question still remains: will HUD and weapon stretched ever be corrected I wonder?