Breaking point

[vinsanity15]

Hello all, I've been attempting to learn MaxED for the better part of a month now and I feel like I'm getting nowhere. I refer to the Remedy tutorial as I work, but sometimes it just doesn't seem to work for me or MaxED crashes anytime I try to boolean something.

I can't help but feel that I'm missing something that should be simple 'cause when I read the tutorials, they make sense. I'm getting frustrated to the point that I feel I'm just never gonna get this, but I really want to make it work. When you guys were first learning did you ever feel this way? Was there ever a point where everything just sort of "clicked" and it made more sense or something specific that you learned that made the process flow more smoothly? Any particularly helpful tutorials? Just curious to hear everyone's thoughts on this.

[vinsanity15]

Well, I've got a fairly new PC (2.4 P4, 512 ddr, Radeon 9700 TX, Windows XP). And thank you, for the tutorials - I haven't had time to work through them, but from just reading them over real quick I think they'll be very useful.

[tommulder]

good good images/icons/smile.gif

well i think that MaxEd becomes unstable in WinXP - that might be the problem. Also, it doesnt like some commands... like if your are building a mesh in F3 mode, then hit F3 again to cancel it will bomb out.

In what instances does it bomb out? What are the messages?

[aavenr]

At first, there were a couple of issues that were really bothering me but with a lot of thinking, analizing and bugging other people to help me out (on this very same forum) i finally was able to overcome them.

For instance, one of these issues was driving me insane was my inability to adequately model rooms. I started to map with a WorldCraft minded modelling approach. I'd do shit i wasn't suppossed to do and later be unable to split the meshes for instance. Once I managed to get the hang out of it and understand the modelling philosophy behind MaxED everything came out so much easier. I've made a tutorial/article on this particular issue that may help you or other newbie mappers: Backface Culling and Room Modelling (http://aavenr.8m.com/ar_backface.html)

There were a lot of other things I had trouble understanding at the beginning or that would just give me problems when crafting my levels but I never gave up. I asked for help and analized those things real hard until I cracked the solution or understood the explanation. And when that ultimately hapenned the feeling was truly rewarding. My advice is to hang in there, post your inquiries here and stick with it until there's nothing standing between you and some cool levels.

No pain, No gain. A wise man once said that.

[ 03-02-2003, 09:18 PM: Message edited by: aavenr ]

[tommulder]

i never got frustrated - unless i lost like 45mins work, however i would read user-made tutorials that are easier to understand (remedy ones, i think they got too fluent in it and took alot for granted - that the user would do w/out being told) would suddenly show me how to do something.

As for crashing - what system are you using (PC+Operating)

Well have a look at my site, the tutorials section has some quick+more advanced tutorials, if they are anygood or need some refinement please let me know.

Max Payne Extra (http://maxpayneextra.paynereactor.com/) (my site)

[vinsanity15]

Yeah, of course now that you're asking me for an error message I'm not getting one, but I'll certainly post it when it happens again. I think more than anything it's the little things that really get to me. For example, sometimes I try to do something as simple as extruding the edge of a room and it won't budge for the first 9 times that I try, but maybe the 10th time it'll work. Or if I do something and forget to hold it beforehand and it's something I can't undo. Not to mention that it's a bit daunting to know it's only gonna get harder: I haven't even started to mess with FSM's yet (well except for the basic jumpoint type stuff). Chalk that up to inexperience I guess.

But aavenr makes a good point: anything worth doing is worth the effort in the long run, so I'll definitely keep trying. Who knows, maybe by the time Max Payne 2 comes out I'll even be able to make a level worth uploading.

I'd still love to hear anything useful you guys picked up as you were just learning all this.

[tommulder]

hmmm well this might just be me being fussy... but i have (normally) a well-structured hierarchy. Keep thier names relevant, small etc.

Booleans w/out any textures means that meshs become unselectable... go to F5 + crtl+a to select all, then texturise with "t" to get them working again.

PLAN your levels - youl have a gr8 idea for something, but if you have no plan it WILL fall flat, guarenteed graemlins/doh.gif

DONT try too complicated AI stuff... it can just get messy. Remember, save you level as certain points and keep a backup. When done w/geometry, backup, when do w/items, backup, when do w/DOs, backup etc etc etc

well thats all i can be bothered to think of atm images/icons/smile.gif mebbe il put some more up sometime.

[LJHalfbreed]

Heh... Using MaxED is an exercise in futility.

Well... maybe not quite that bad. Basically, I look at it as if I was playing a game on my old-school Nintendo. The thing was flakey and would give me the blinky-screen if I looked at it funny, but I still stuck with it because I wanted to finally beat zelda one last time before I retired the system.

How does this analogy apply to you? I'll explain and build upon what others have already stated:

1.) Plan ahead fully and accordingly.

MaxED likes to crash. Plan for it by saving frequently, or even edit the option for auto-saving. Also, limit the amount of time you leave it 'idle' by taking a bunch of graph paper and trying to do a layout of your level before hand. Look around town or in books for ideas on how to make your level realistic, and then put it to use. Save under a different name after every 'vital' change or addition. I'll be honest and say that when doing a level, it's not uncommon for me to have a few dozen 'saves' at various points for it.

2.) Don't hate the editor, hate the programmers.

Pretend that the programmers purposely set up the editor to work perfectly against your style and ideas of design. Then, presevere against them and make each effort an "Eat THIS!" type of exclaim against them. The anger can help fuel your drive, but I don't recommend breaking anything or calling anyone names... it's just pretend!

3.) Research, research, research. Getting stuck in a particular part or area? Feel free to look it up somewhere online. If you can't find it, post your question here *BUT* continue on the level anyway. You won't lose any vital time, and you might even figure out how to fix the problem on your own.

Hope this all helps, and keep up the good work... you'll enjoy it in the end and have something to laugh about later.

-LJ

[Mrd4]

Of those, number two is most helpful. Misplaced anger is what I think it's called. images/icons/wink.gif

[tommulder]

yea well if its kicking your ass, just take a break for a bit. Think over diffferent posibilities that will give the same (or similar) results.

glad i actually HELPED someone images/icons/smile.gif normally i get corrected images/icons/rolleyes.gif