Dream Sequence as annoying as the alein level in Half-Life

[Guest]

I love this game, just like I loved Half-Life. It is perfect in everyway except one, the stupid inane repetitive dream sequence. Why did you put this in this game, it is boring to play and annoying when you keep walking down the stupid hallways or falling off that dumb ribbon of blood or whatever it is.

Just like Half-Life when the game essentially ends and you are taken to some Alien place and have to jump around like an idiot.



I give the game a 9.0 only because I cannot stand jumping along a ribbon of blood.

I give the game a 9.0 only because I cannot stand jumping along a ribbon of blood.

[Racerprose]

The first dream was okay, you get the point of it all with it, but the second was just stupid.

[Mugg]

I agree but I guess I got lucky or something and managed to find the right way on my first try. What's even more annoying is that fire in the resteraunt level. That one sucks the big one.

[Bliah]

I disagree....as annoying as the blood trail was when you encounter it, it's super simple to navigate. The dreams show his anxiety and self guilt for the death of his wife and kid and add some depth to the insanity that is taken him over.

Plus the drug trip sequence with the note on the table and the telephone was funny as hell.

The fire sequence was short and visually awesome. Just like a scene in a movie...things flying across the screen and smashing out windows..it was great. Plus it too was short..only 4 rooms and anyone who got stuck on that part needs to learn how to use quicksave. I saw plenty of posts on help I'm stuck..blah blah...it takes less time to reload and try an alternate route on that level than it does to post for help.

My 2 cents.

-Bliah-

[George Broussard]

The dream sequences are ultra small/simple mazes that take you about 10 minutes to get through.

I often wonder if people bother quicksaving in them, because if you do, they are done in 5-10 minutes each. They just aren't that complex images/icons/smile.gif

I love them, personally.

[Guest]

yes i had no trouble with them, a few quick saves and i wa out in a couple minutes, and teh fire level... HOW CAN YOU NOT LIKE IT!?!?!

it is one of the greates game levels in the whole industry to date.... it is a piece of art, and is magnificent!! all the explosions and flames drool it rules.......

[RollingBrass]

The flame level was quite annoying at first (I couldn't figure out that there was a staircase that wasn't engulfed in flames on the left). After checking out an online walkthrough for just the beginning, I went through it no problem. Now that I know where to go, I can admire the details. It really is a cool level.

[Thysis]

I hated the dream sequence levels, they weren't difficult, but whenever I would get onto a blood trail, there was a very good chance that the game would lock up if I looked back from a distance at the two doors. That's the only time the game has ever locked up on me. Hard lock, nothing responds, not even the three fingered salute.

Celeron2 600
Abit BX133 RAID
512 MB PC-133
PCI Voodoo 3 2000
Windows 98 FE
SB Live! 5.1 Platinum
2 20GB non-raid Maxtor HD's

Nothing is overclocked, there are no programs in the background (minus explorer and systray).

But usually I can get through the dreams without lockup if I don't look at both doors at once.

[Floyd-ATC]

I find the fire sequence a bit frustrating because there's really no time to think or get oriented, especially in the dark rooms with all the tables, plants and chairs that make it extremely hard to see where you're going.

Still, it only took me about 5 minutes to get through.

...with only a bit of bad language images/icons/wink.gif

As for the dream and drug sequences, I can't really see anything wrong with them? Incredibly easy and as Bliah points out they serve to better understand what the lead character is feeling.

If you don't care about the storyline, you're really missing out :-)

[Knemeses]

I personally found the fast pace of the fire level adrenaline-pumping. Mush like I found most of the game. I was taken completly by surprize when I came to the level expecting just another shooting level. And took a step forward only to have fire erupst from where I was just standing. I ran toward a hallway looking for a way out and fire erupted there. I looked around anctiously for an escape route and found it threw some double doors. The rest of the level continued like that. So I think the fire level was well, done. It broke up the pace, didn't over stay it's welcome and gave a nice adrenaline shot in the arm to a time when the game was becoming just slightly monotonous.

However, I do have beef with the dream sequences. The hallways aren't so bad but finding the path along the trails of blood was adrenaline-DRAINING! In fact the 2 sequences that I have come-across, have been right after such adrenaline pumping levels that they seem even more shoddy than they would have been otherwise. (I haven't finished the game yet. I am just starting the 3rd part on the level after the dream.) Anyway, this is still a great game that I would recomend to everyone who doesn't have it.

[ 08-26-2001: Message edited by: Knemeses ]

[Co11]

I entirely agree with bilah!

Every game has a maze of some sort, just be glad you weren't cursed with Rune styled mazes where you have to find the exit in a certain amount of time other wise you have to start over... also the maze tips upside down at some point if I remember correctly... that was annoying!

I love the tunneling effect when you run down the hall, you think it's short, but it's not... Freaky!

[jakek101]

IMHO the dream levels are great and add a dark feeling to the game. "I'm in a video game this is the worst thing that could happen". Also IMO the fire level is the best level in the game. It takes a wile to figure out but it is a fun break from the pacee of the game a little puzzle action. Also a tip on the maze in the first dream level:stay on the right wall ajnd you will get to the end. images/icons/smile.gif

[sempy823]

I didn't mind the dream sequences as I thought they were quite surreal and added an extra element to the game. Neither went on long enough. The dodgy platforming of the blood trails was a little irritating, but over quickly enough.

The flaming restaurant annoyed me a lot. I thought it was a great idea but very frustrating. Again I think it would have been really quite an exciting moment if I did not have to play through it 400 times, each time getting maybe marginally further, or again maybe not.

Repetition ruins the atmosphere of a game, so instead of it being a pulse-racing adrenaline-fuelled moment it just pissed me off, which I don't think is a good thing.

images/icons/wink.gif

[illusion]

It would have been cool if they were scary, but they were interesting none-the-less. And indeed super simple.

First one took me less than a minute to beat, I said to myself, if I made a maze, I'd put the *spoiler* exit near the beginning so first thing I did was stay left and when I got to the bloodlines I jumped the path over to the left path and boom, it worked *end spoiler*.

The second one was a little different, but I took the same approach. I think I spent more time trying to get out of the fire in the restaurant.

[biXen]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by MovieGuy:
I love this game, just like I loved Half-Life. It is perfect in everyway except one, the stupid inane repetitive dream sequence. Why did you put this in this game, it is boring to play and annoying when you keep walking down the stupid hallways or falling off that dumb ribbon of blood or whatever it is.

Just like Half-Life when the game essentially ends and you are taken to some Alien place and have to jump around like an idiot.



I give the game a 9.0 only because I cannot stand jumping along a ribbon of blood.

I give the game a 9.0 only because I cannot stand jumping along a ribbon of blood.<hr></blockquote>

Movieguy as annoying as a cat in an aquarium.

The nightmare is there for you too feel Max's feelings, fear, guilt and so on. It couldn't have been done better, and they are greatly designed, I was through them in no time. I really can't see what's the problem with them. I'll agree, they are not as fun as the shooting ones, but they are vital to the game, every part can't be the best one...

Oh, and for the flame levels. If you run really fast, doesn't matter if it's the wrong way, you can walk around and look around for ages most places. I did that in the kitchen... and those are really great levels, took me no more than 10 minutes to get through it all though...

[ 08-27-2001: Message edited by: biXen ]

[Jabberwhacky]

I didn't feel crap during those cursed dream sequences except annoyed. We saw his wife/daughter like twice in a frame, and now we're being put through his guilt and anguish? If we were supposed to feel something maybe we could have gotten to know the people who died, instead of just "Wife, kid, you home? You're dead! Argh! *commence 3 day ass-whoop*". The baby crying and woman crying were pretty good, and by good I mean disturbing. But after reloading lots because I slipped on the blood and drifted gently to the invisible floor, it was just irritating.

I personally loved the restaurant level. It took me a few deaths to realize what the hell I was supposed to do, but then I got through it relatively in one try (that one corridor just after the monitor flies through the window gets me a lot, where you have to jump over some flames). Also, once you enter the kitch, there's a litte chute to the right of the stairs you go down, and you can hurl a grenade down hither and blow the guys away...figured that out second time through.

[Guest]

I clearly understand the point of the two dream/trip levels and I agree they are creapy. But I just can't stand the stupid ribbon of blood that is so easy to slip off. Why do you die when you slip off the river, you would think you would just wake up.

I am playing the game a second time and I still HATE HATE HATE the stupid ribbons.

Why do developers constantly add plaforming levels to shooters, when the game does not lend itself to that type of action?

PS I liked the fire level, completely different thing, no unfair jumping.

[aikman]

So many seem to support the dream sequences, that I fell I have to raise my voice against them. They are not freaky, or cool, just plain annoying. Okay, they are easy to play through, but I didn't spend the bucks to play platform games.

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally by BliahThe dreams show his anxiety and self guilt for the death of his wife and kid and add some depth to the insanity that is taken him over.<hr></blockquote>Oh, please... If the story is so important, why not just show it as a movie clip? Or maybe this is the reason why Max can go into Bullet-time, and carry twelve-or-so guns and their ammo? images/icons/rolleyes.gif

I do like the game otherwise, it's a great FPS. Even a regular strategy game player like myself can truly enjoy the action; and that is why I bought it.

[Jabberwhacky]

I think having a dream sequence isn't a bad idea, as long as they don't put in stupid things like jumping puzzles. Although, if I had nightmares in a game, it'd be about having to complete jumping puzzles.

[BZMew2]

The dream sequences weren't as annoying as Xen in Half-Life, in my oppinion. Although you get the illusion that it's a HUGE level; it's actually very tiny. On the blood trails, you just gotta save your game right before-hand and take the right path. If you're on Dead On Arrival difficulty, this *MIGHT* be a good place to use one of your saves; but if you know the first area real well it's not worth it to save.

The second "dream sequence" was actually a "drug trip". There was a BIG DIFFERENCE between the two. The dream was a nightmare of bad things, the drug trip was a mess of senseless jibberish that didn't make sense. The trip was highly illogical, and nothing in it could have happened. I mean, you shooting your younger self was just... not right. It was meant to be that way.

It's easy when you get the hang of it; the dream sequence was necassary and they nailed the hammer on the head when it came to atmosphere! images/icons/smile.gif

[ 09-01-2001: Message edited by: BZMew2 ]

[BZMew2]

/me ignores the open flame in this thread

Please clean it up; it sickens me to see people flaming others images/icons/frown.gif

[Aegeri]

As I said, the jumping puzzles present in BOTH dream sequences were incredibly basic. Honestly, I can understand why people hate them [I despise Xen myself] but they were two SMALL sections.

They were EASY to do. One save before, one save after and that was it.

The dream sequence, trip sequence were probably to represent his inner pain, and later his fight against the drug. Both are part of character development of Mr Payne and are story related.

However I will say that if they weren't in the game I wouldn't miss em. But they are and I don't mind them.

[Grande 3:16]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by RollingBrass:
I couldn't figure out that there was a staircase that wasn't engulfed in flames on the left<hr></blockquote>Took me a while to realise that too.

[Guest]

Jabberwhacky it seems that u dont get the storyline the first time u play... if u really concentrated on the story im sure u would have noticed that he started his rampage 3 years or so after his family died... just some information fer ya .

[TheSubject]

The mazes are frustrating, right. But that is their purpose - to feel like Max does. Lost and with the voices of his ghosts talking. These sequences really made me mad, but they are an important part of the atmosphere. However,although they are easy, in an eventual sequel it will be good not to include such levels. Remedy may add a dream sequence, but not a labyrinth, that will piss the gamers off. As for the fire in the resaurant - i really liked that part, especially the last 2 rooms, where all the things looked chaotic and not arranged like the straight fire corridors in the first rooms.

[sproket]

Well, i have to say that the thing that really didnt make sense to me is how you could "die" in them. They are "dream" sequences after all.

I remeber in the first one i got to the empty doorway with the blood trailing off and just walked right out. I started falling and expected to wake up. Instead I die? It didn't make a lot of sense.

I enjoyed the atmosphere of the dream sequences and would have liked to have seen more scripted events in a linear progression as opposed to mazes. I think that what they add to the story is great but the maze really only detracts as opposed to adding to the experience. And dying in them is just silly imho.

I suppose in the 2nd one it is possible that you overdose or something. But even then. It is out of place to be able to die. I would think dying in any dream sequence would result in your waking up. not the game ending.

[Guest]

hehe those trails of blood scenes are easy as hell...all you do at the beggining is jump offa to the left and turn 180 and you will see the exit RIGHT BELOW YOU....i guess the whole path is there to tell you that you dont need to take the complicated way when the easy way is only secluded by the illusion of egotism...kinda like an acid trip....where your ego throws you into a loop

[aikman]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by sproket:
I would think dying in any dream sequence would result in your waking up. not the game ending.<hr></blockquote>Or better yet, you'd "drop" back to the beginning of dream sequence. That'd be more "dreamlike".

Still, I personally would prefer these dream sequence to be movie-type bits, not playable bits.

[rob2001]

The dream sequences were really annoying and pointless. Walking along a trail of blood? Give me a break! There was too much emphasis on his wife and baby being killed. The burning restaurant was completely unrealistic. How in the world could anyone survive running through a restaurant totally engulfed in flames? If the flames didn't kill him, the smoke inhalation would have. One scene that was great was when Max was in the mafia boss' mansion. That was like the movie Scarface. Also the scenes on the boat and in the nightclub were cool too. images/icons/rolleyes.gif

[Komb.at]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by rob2001:
The burning restaurant was completely unrealistic. How in the world could anyone survive running through a restaurant totally engulfed in flames? If the flames didn't kill him, the smoke inhalation would have<hr></blockquote>

Ya how unrealistic ... and how max can take serveral bullets without dying ... or like he can slow down time, or how he can reload a some weapons THAT fast ... or like he can dive and stuff without hurting himself ..
i haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaate those unrealistic games ...

not?

gimme a break images/icons/rolleyes.gif

[Guest]

I stopped the game because of the dream sequence. It totally sucks. I just don't like that type of game, I don't have the patience for it. The only games I play are the "blow em away" type stuff. I can understand a dream sequence whild drugged, but this puzzle stuff just plain sucks.

[Grande 3:16]

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by sproket:
Well, i have to say that the thing that really didnt make sense to me is how you could "die" in them. They are "dream" sequences after all.

I remeber in the first one i got to the empty doorway with the blood trailing off and just walked right out. I started falling and expected to wake up. Instead I die? It didn't make a lot of sense.

I enjoyed the atmosphere of the dream sequences and would have liked to have seen more scripted events in a linear progression as opposed to mazes. I think that what they add to the story is great but the maze really only detracts as opposed to adding to the experience. And dying in them is just silly imho.

I suppose in the 2nd one it is possible that you overdose or something. But even then. It is out of place to be able to die. I would think dying in any dream sequence would result in your waking up. not the game ending.<hr></blockquote>I agree with everything here 101%. When I've said "You don't die in a dream, you just wake up" I've gotten responses like "No, if you die in a dream you die in real life".
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by aikman:
Or better yet, you'd "drop" back to the beginning of dream sequence. That'd be more "dreamlike".

Still, I personally would prefer these dream sequence to be movie-type bits, not playable bits.<hr></blockquote>And I agree with this too. I think dropping back to the start instead of dying is a much better idea.

[Guest]

the dream sequences were easily the stupidest parts of max payne. the tunneling effect in the hallways is cool, the glowing staircase, the fight with yourself, et cetera.. but then your jumping from blood spot to blood spot in a giant empty void with bloody snow. if there was any symbolism, if there was any point to to running through a maze and jumping from platform to platform over an instant death fall, then it was lost on me.
the resturant was undoubtedly a cool idea on paper, but its basically an instant kill level the first five times. and instant kill levels, instant kill death traps, instant kill anything, where the only solution is reloading ten times.. SUCKS.

[Joker192]

Whine whine whine get over it the whole game is supurb i give it a 9.5 just because i get a lot of errors i woulden't complain about that when i got crashes with new video cards and lagginess from hell. ill show u blood after i beat the snot outta my cpu images/icons/mad.gif images/icons/confused.gif images/icons/wink.gif images/icons/tongue.gif