MaxPayne2 Graphics

[Gideon]

I don't see much of a change in the graphics for MP2. I realize some of the characters are more detailed, but for the most part, it looks like the same game.

[ADM]

Have a look at the videos (especially the Fileplanet one) and you'll notice that theres a change, not too big though. Just seems like alot more effects going on at one time and all of them are beautiful.

[Yatta]

Actually I think MP2 is a huge improvement from the original game, in terms of both visual effects and the amount of detail. Just by the minimum system requirements you can tell the game is quite heavy.

Recommend requirements in the original Max Payne was 700-800MHz but the minimum spec for MP2 is 1.2GHz! http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif

[Joonas]

Umm...

You say it as plural and just talk about processor speed? http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

Processor isn't that important, graphics card is.

[Zero Beat]

Some of the larger surface covering textures like on the stone ground in that blown up car shot do look of comparable quality to Max 1's.

There're two things I'd like to point out that I love graphically -

- The stream of fire left in an arc behind thrown molotov's looks superb, and even better is the appearance of fire through thick smoke. Dreamy.
- Shadows. I'm a little sick of the wobbly edged roughness most games throw up right now but I'm happy to see (in that screenshot where Max looks like he's just spun, and still squatting) that we've got soft-edged shadows in Max2. The latest Half Life 2 video showcasing DX9 effects with shiny rooftiles etc lets you see its soft shadows pretty close up and you can still see some of that wobblyness through the graduated edge. Max 2's shadows don't seem to have such a problem, I'm mucho-impressed.

[mysteryperfecta]

I don't see much of a change in the graphics for MP2. I realize some of the characters are more detailed, but for the most part, it looks like the same game.



That it does. Maybe this means that they've been able to put a lot of time into content.

[MikaRMD]

I don't see much of a change in the graphics for MP2. I realize some of the characters are more detailed, but for the most part, it looks like the same game.



That it does. Maybe this means that they've been able to put a lot of time into content.



Looking at Max Payne and Max Payne 2, I really do not see the basis of what you are talking about. The graphics are Clearly Superior. I dare say that the content has improved, as well.

But I guess these matters are subjective and you'll have a chance soon enough to form your opinions on the final game rather than screenshots/videos.

(and that was meant in a nicest possible way without any hidden meanings.)

[SkavenRMD]

Game discussion forum: a place where you can see both "it doesn't look like the original" and "it looks like the original" register as complaints.

[biXen]

Not sure how I'll say this nicely. But if you can't see a difference between Max Payne 1 and Max Payne 2 you've got visual problems beyond the help of anyone but laser eye specialists.

Still, I know some of you in here (won't mention names) just like to complain because complaining and having different opinions is fun. Let's just see http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wid.gif

[FullMetalJacket]

Not sure how I'll say this nicely. But if you can't see a difference between Max Payne 1 and Max Payne 2 you've got visual problems beyond the help of anyone but laser eye specialists.



True.

And Skaven, that was just about the funniest thing I ever read. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Gideon]

I didn't mean it as a complaint. The game looks great just like the first one did. I'm just saying that I don't see much difference in the levels.

I havn't seen a great deal of media yet, some screens and a movie.

[biXen]

Well why comment if you know almost nothing of the case at hand?

At http://www.paynereactor.com/maxpayne2-screenshots.htm there should be 28 screenshots from Max Payne 2, at http://www.paynereactor.com/maxpayne-screenshots.htm there's also a few. You should get a good impression about the change in graphics, and general improvements done to the game.

[dark_angel]

Damn Max2 Graphics are simply awesome, With pixel shaders and advanced Lightning/physics Max Payne2 will Kick ass !

Cant wait to play it....

http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[mysteryperfecta]

Not sure how I'll say this nicely. But if you can't see a difference between Max Payne 1 and Max Payne 2 you've got visual problems beyond the help of anyone but laser eye specialists.



Nobody has said that they didn't see a difference. Clearly, the models are higher poly. The particle effects I've seen look beefed up. If the lighting has improved, so be it; I can't really tell from the crappy streaming videos I've seen, and the screens aren't a good indication of lighting (although I saw some good model shadows). What Mr3drmax was specifically commenting on (I think), and a point on which I agree (from what I've seen), is that the levels look pretty similar. MP1's photosource textures look fantastic, and so do MP2's. I'm not sure if I notice a significant difference in the amount of polys dedicated to populating the levels.

This is a definately a "wait-and-see" (or "wait-to-see-more") proposition, as you've stated, bixen. I think Mr3drmax was just seeing if anyone else got the same impression from the screens/vids about the overall look of the levels.

[biXen]

Well I'm pretty sure they are saving polys where they feel they can. Remember when you see things in 3rd person perspective most of the level is further away than usually. The whole trick to level editing is to use a texture to make things seem 3D instead of making the same with polys if it doesn't look worse. Remedy are great at that, so I think we'll see a pretty consistent rise in the quality of levels. But they can't make everything top notch either I'm sure, so we'll see.

[mysteryperfecta]

I feel the need to clarify my own comments about Max 2's graphics:

1. The graphical leap from Max 1 to Max 2 does not seem like a generational leap in the way that say, UT to Unreal2 is, or Quake 3 to Doom 3 is. From the media I've seen, it looks like Max2's graphics are based on an "enhanced" Max 1 engine, and not something so significantly different as to warrant a separate distinction.

QUALIFIER: Remedy, from what I've read, has never claimed anything more than this, and hasn't made a separate distinction. IMO, Max 1's graphics have aged very well, and the enhancements Remedy has made stand up very well against other current engines.

2. More importantly, to me, is that the Max 2 locales we've been shown are strikingly similar to what we saw in Max 1. The streets are practically identical. Ditto the warehouses. One Max 2 screen looks straight from RagnaRock. In this way, the feeling of deja vu has possibly contributed to my, and perhaps Mr3drmax's, perception of the graphics.

[FullMetalJacket]

it looks like Max2's graphics are based on an "enhanced" Max 1 engine



Well, duh. Max2 is still using the MAX-FX engine. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Gideon]

What Mr3drmax was specifically commenting on (I think), and a point on which I agree (from what I've seen), is that the levels look pretty similar.



That's basically what I'm saying. I mean, mostly in the city scenes when your out on the streets and stuff. The indoor stuff seems to have alot of improvement. Remedy did an awesome job on MP1 and it looks like an awesome job on MP2. Also, as someone said earlier, MP2 isn't a huge leap forward like UT to UT2k3, Quake3 to Doom 3 ect. I realize you guys have made awesome advances with the engine and everything looks great. Not once did I say anything sucked.

[Ninja]

I wonder how big levels (particularly outdoor ones) can be in Max Payne 2...

[Gideon]

They do look a bit larger than the MP1 Levels.

[KillJoy]

Does Max-Fx handle outdoor levels very well?

IMHO Max FX is a mostly an indoor game engine. Of course this is based off of what modding I have done. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

Did you guys make Max FX capable of handling both outdoor and indoor enviornments, or do you still craft the situation around the limitations of the particular engine (e.g. If your engine can't do reflections very well, you rarely put the player in a situation where that flaw would be accentuated)

I am just curious if that revision was made when you were revamping the old MP1 engine.

[SkavenRMD]

The Max-FX engine still uses exit optimizations, which makes it best suited for indoor levels. Large outdoor areas can be made, but everything must be in a "room" (even if the room can be huge if so desired). Just as before, you can make a room large enough to accommodate several skyscrapers.

The most major revision has been made to the MaxEd editor. It has been more or less completely re-written, including the memory and resource management structure. The user interface is kept familiar, but with a plethora of enhancements.

The rendering engine (used to calculate lighting for the levels) is also radically faster now. It's based on raycasting and lumigraphs (gee, fancy words) as opposed to the first renderer's radiosity. In network rendering, the render slaves don't need to download the entire level to render it - downloading a single room is enough. The endless rendering sessions are a thing of the past.

[KillJoy]

Awesome,

thanks for the quick reply Skaven. http://forums.3drealms.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[biXen]

Erm, the levels look similar? It's still supposed to look like New York you know. Point is that once again Remedy manages to whip up some revolutionary graphics, this time just by improving their old technology. Quake 3 -> Doom 3 might be a big leap, but it still looks like ****. New tech doesn't necessarily mean it looks real. HL2 is a bigger leap if we are using examples. Unreal 1 -> 2 is a big leap, but the game was crap, and it took 6 years or something. I don't quite see the point, it's still themed the same, only a lot more improved now + parts of the levels are much more interactive this time around due to physics.