Japanese Max Payne

[MikaRMD]

Hi all and greetings from E3.
Everything went very nicely at the show and we all have lots of goodness coming to us later this year. I guess most of you have already seen and linked to every piece of information released. More will be released in the coming months and don't worry: we remember you our dear fans and friends at 3DR forums. This is still the number 1 place to stay up-to-date on Max Payne 2.

To the topic: Max Payne is being released today in Japan! I haven't seen it myself, but it will be very interesting to hear Max in Japanese. Hopefully we get some Japanese fans here as well to tell about their experiences of Max Payne.

Here's a link toys R us Japan (http://www.toysrus.co.jp/vgame/cat_detail.sp?ITEM_ID=781037&SUB_ITEM_ID=000&TAB_ID=2&CAT_ID=0&TABLE_NAME=TAB_TOP_0001&x=34&y=56)

So, let me see, Max is now available at least in English, Spanish, French, Portuguese, Russian, Polish and Japanese. I think I forgot one, since I have a feeling there should have been seven language versions before Japanese.

[Bludd]

Isn't it strange to see/hear yourself speaking all those languages?

I mean, since you guys digitized yourself, it must be kinda weird.

[mullen]

how come it took so long for it to be released in japan?

[Fraeon Waser Duhni]

Serves them right for having all the sweet stuff released in their country ages before we can have it. images/icons/tongue.gif

[Jade]

Originally posted by MikaRMD:

I think I forgot one, since I have a feeling there should have been seven language versions before Japanese. <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You forgot Italian images/icons/wink.gif , Max has lots of fans here images/icons/smile.gif

Btw...I would be courious to see the graphic novel in japanese, cool images/icons/grin.gif

[ 05-22-2003, 03:48 PM: Message edited by: Jade ]

[The Baskinator]

w00t!

*looking at prices* Hmmn...

5,999¥ (gosen-kyuhyaku-kyu-jyu-kyu-en, a mouthful) is a little over fifty U.S. dollars (the sale price). It's about fifty-five U.S. regularly. That isn't too bad-- less than I expected.

[Bludd]

Since japanese males in movies always sound really angry, that bodes well for the Max Payne voice overs. images/icons/smile.gif

[Chimera]

Imagine an angry sounding Japanese guy doing a voiceover as Max Payne. I challenge you not to laugh images/icons/tongue.gif


(Of course it may just be my strange little mind that finds it funny images/icons/rolleyes.gif )

[Bludd]

Yeah, it might be funny, but you've got to remember that there are some real badasses in Max Payne. Remember Lupino? Now imagine his speech in angry japanese.

[Kev_Hectic]

Cool images/icons/smile.gif But I only see the PS2 version though. Are the PC and Xbox games going to be released in Japan as well?

I'd imagine due to the unpopularity of the XBox over there, the PC game would be the more likely of the two to get a release.

[Mongorian]

PC's arent really that popular over in japan, besides using them for the internet. at least thats what ive been told.

theyre not caught up in the hardware craze like us north americans are. images/icons/grin.gif

[The Baskinator]

The dialogue won't even be in the same order, since the Japanese language isn't set up in S.V.O. (subject, verb, object) format, like English.

I used to make jokes about the Japanese language, but now that I'm learning it, those jokes aren't really funny. It's a beautiful and complicated language.

I find English language natives to be incredibly insensitive to Japanese people and their language, since it is such a radical change from English. (I'm not saying you're being insensitive. This is more of a general statement.) A past exchange student at Southeast wrote a heartbreaking essay about her experiences with learning English and the tactless people she came into contact with. I quote her as saying, “Sometimes I was embarrassed of my thick Japanese accent.” Why anyone should be embarrassed of an accent is beyond me.

While I'm at it, I might as well address this too. Their "incapability" (they're perfectly capable, just not accustomed) to pronounce "L" is really a matter of where their tongue meets the roof of their mouths when speaking and it disappears after studying English for so long. Because they don't have an "L" syllable set featured in their language, they have never been taught to pronounce it. Now that most schools in Japan are teaching children English at an early age, or so I hear, along with their Japanese language schooling, you may see that change. Eventually, as sad as it sounds to me, we may not even have to translate games into Japanese.

. . . Stop looking at me like that . . . *runs away*

[MikaRMD]

ummm...I am not THE most technical guy, but as I understood the reason why it took this long is pretty much in the language: not the part that it is difficult, but that the Japanese characters take more memory than the Western ones. That apparently creates technical problems of all sorts. It did take some time to make all the necessary changes (including audio).

Not many Western games make it to the Japanese market. Partly, I think this is due to different consumer tastes in gaming. Another part is the language problem. I hear that there is little reason to go to the market with a game in English.

Yes, I think only PS2 version is going to come out in Japan for the reasons mentioned by Mongorian. Same goes for XBOX. Well at least, for the time being, it seems that Microsoft is having hard time penetrating the Japanese market with XBOX.

Basky... I am deeply impressed by your last post. Are you sure it wasn't a copy/paste? images/icons/wink.gif

[MikaRMD]

Totally unrelated question: Does anybody know why the time of posting does not show anymore? It is really difficult to try to figure out which threads have new posts and which I have already read...

[Maddieman]

^Try updating your profile -- it worked for me.

Also, there's a thread about it here:

http://forums.3drealms.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=012362

Incidentally, I heard about a year ago that first person shooters aren't really that popular in Japan. That would probably explain why the PC market isn't particularly strong.

[ 05-23-2003, 06:06 AM: Message edited by: Maddieman ]

[theHunted]

Originally posted by MikaRMD:
... the Japanese characters take more memory than the Western ones. That apparently creates technical problems of all sorts....<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">you mean characters as in "a" "b" "c"
or as in "player models"?
obviously the first one. i'd love to see the latter one though. max payne with all new japanese enemies images/icons/smile.gif
but who knows, maybe we'll get to play in china town in mp2 images/icons/grin.gif

[j]

Originally posted by Mongorian:
PC's arent really that popular over in japan, besides using them for the internet. at least thats what ive been told.

theyre not caught up in the hardware craze like us north americans are. images/icons/grin.gif <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Umm.. excuse me, but wha-a-a-a-at? I don't think I've ever heard of any overclocking (or other "hardware craze" related) news from anywhere other than Japan or Europe. Afaik, all you north americans do with your PCs is play games.

Originally posted by The Baskinator:
Eventually, as sad as it sounds to me, we may not even have to translate games into Japanese.<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I find it much worse that people need to translate games (and movies!) to other languages. Subtitling isn't that bad, but dubbing an entire game's (or movie's) dialogue in a language other than the one it was written in is inexcusable!

I say shoot all the italians, french, germans and anyone else who goes around raping soundtracks.

[MikaRMD]

Originally posted by Maddieman:
^Try updating your profile -- it worked for me.<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Thanks Maddie. It helped.

[Joe Siegler]

I hear that there is little reason to go to the market with a game in English.<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Then how do you explain how American music is popular over there? They don't re-record it, they sing it in English.

[MikaRMD]

I don't know. That's only what I hear. Why do you think Western computer games have difficulties in penetrating the Japanese market? Lack of marketing? Lack of understanding the consumers? Cultural differences? Naturally the language is just one thing.

With music one really does not _need_ to understand the lyrics, whereas (depending on the game) in games it might be critical. Just shooting in the dark.

[The Baskinator]

Mika:
Basky... I am deeply impressed by your last post. Are you sure it wasn't a copy/paste? <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">*laughs* Very sure! images/icons/grin.gif Thanks.

j:
I find it much worse that people need to translate games (and movies!) to other languages. Subtitling isn't that bad, but dubbing an entire game's (or movie's) dialogue in a language other than the one it was written in is inexcusable!

I say shoot all the italians, french, germans and anyone else who goes around raping soundtracks. <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Um, interesting belief. Not big on humanitarianism, I see. images/icons/wink.gif I've always considered translating books, movies and games into other languages to be a common courtesy.

Languages are dying out all the time. I hate to see that happen, since it, more or less, stamps out individuality amongst cultures.

[Mongorian]

Originally posted by j:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Mongorian:
PC's arent really that popular over in japan, besides using them for the internet. at least thats what ive been told.

theyre not caught up in the hardware craze like us north americans are. images/icons/grin.gif <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Umm.. excuse me, but wha-a-a-a-at? I don't think I've ever heard of any overclocking (or other "hardware craze" related) news from anywhere other than Japan or Europe. Afaik, all you north americans do with your PCs is play games.

Originally posted by The Baskinator:
Eventually, as sad as it sounds to me, we may not even have to translate games into Japanese.<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I find it much worse that people need to translate games (and movies!) to other languages. Subtitling isn't that bad, but dubbing an entire game's (or movie's) dialogue in a language other than the one it was written in is inexcusable!

I say shoot all the italians, french, germans and anyone else who goes around raping soundtracks. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">besides your post being completely insensitive and useless, you're also wrong. us north americans do quite a lot with our pc's. including overclocking. i guaruntee overclocking is a bigger deal in north america than anywhere else in the world. especailly more so than japan.

as for the japanese language, i wish i had taken it in high school instead of spanish but the complexity frightened me.
sometimes i wish i had a different name, since mongorian is from a south park episode where a stereotypical asian fellow cannot pronounce the word mongolian. baskinator, if your post was directed at me, sorry images/icons/grin.gif . i know you didnt call me a racist or anything, but sometimes i fear that my name borders on it. your post really made me think. good job! images/icons/tongue.gif

[Bludd]

Please don't make this a thread about whose country is the best.

Anyway, I find japanese interesting, it'd be a fun language to learn.

[Mongorian]

thats not what i meant by my posting... images/icons/frown.gif

[Fraeon Waser Duhni]

*cough* *cough* I think j frequents Muropaketti a tad too much.

As far as dubs go, I don't mind a dub as long as it's well done. The dubs I have a problem with are those that are the same quality with some of the morning cartoons on Nelonen(And yes, I admit, due to my dysfunctional brain I watch them every now and then while drinking my morning coffee).

[j]

Originally posted by The Baskinator:
I've always considered translating books, movies and games into other languages to be a common courtesy.<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">And also:
Originally posted by Fraeon-Waser-Duhni:
As far as dubs go, I don't mind a dub as long as it's well done.<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I've yet to see a translation that would have "carried everything over" from the original. I think that might have something to do with it being impossible to translate something to a different language while keeping every little nuance intact. Obviously, I'll go with a translation if I can't speak/read the original language, but even then if the original is a game/movie (or anything else with voice acting) I'll be much happier when I can hear the voices of the original actors in the original language and read the subtitles.

Originally posted by Mongorian:
i guaruntee overclocking is a bigger deal in north america than anywhere else in the world. especailly more so than japan.<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Then why do only japanese and european people break overclocking records?

Originally posted by MikaRMD:
With music one really does not _need_ to understand the lyrics, whereas (depending on the game) in games it might be critical. Just shooting in the dark. <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Kind of depends on the music as well, don't you think? If the lyrics are just the regular pop nonsense (boy meets girl, blablabla) they obviously don't matter much, anyone can imagine what they're about. But if it's something with a message (http://www.systemofadown.com/) it's nice if the listener actually unterstands the words.

Whew, long post.

EDIT: Oh wait, it only seemed like a long post, but it's not images/icons/tongue.gif

[ 05-23-2003, 06:26 PM: Message edited by: j ]

[MikaRMD]

Originally posted by j:
MikaRMD:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">With music one really does not _need_ to understand the lyrics, whereas (depending on the game) in games it might be critical. Just shooting in the dark. <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Kind of depends on the music as well, don't you think? If the lyrics are just the regular pop nonsense (boy meets girl, blablabla) they obviously don't matter much, anyone can imagine what they're about. But if it's something with a message (http://www.systemofadown.com/) it's nice if the listener actually unterstands the words.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hey, all I am saying is people can sing and like a song without understanding any of the lyrics.
That lyrics can increase the enjoyment/overall experience is pretty much obvious, don't you think?

[shiranui]

Being an Innocuous subject, I dont really care. But you're all talking out of your asses

Unless you live here, keep your misinformed comments to yourselves.


95% of US games come to Japan
EAs games are usually here less than a month after US releases. Yes, those that have a lot of text in them are localised, but many have a option to install in Japanese or English. EA really excels in this area. anyway I saw Max Payne in the shops here years ago. Maybe it was just subtitled.

Want to see US games? walk into the PC games section of Yodobashi Camera........

[ 05-24-2003, 06:57 AM: Message edited by: shiranui ]

[Bludd]

Ah, one can always count on shiranui to debunk anything in a graceful manner. images/icons/wink.gif

[Mongorian]

my honest mistake. like i said earlier, its what i had heard. maybe the whole guarunteeing thing was a bit much though images/icons/grin.gif

[j]

Originally posted by MikaRMD:
Hey, all I am saying is people can sing and like a song without understanding any of the lyrics.
That lyrics can increase the enjoyment/overall experience is pretty much obvious, don't you think? <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You can just as easily play and like a game without understanding any of the dialogue/text, while understanding the dialogue/text can increase the enjoyment/overall experience, don't you think? It obviously depends on the type of game though, as the need to understand the lyrics depends on the type of music. You can't get much out of a political song if you don't speak the language it's written in, nor can you get much out of a text adventure in a foreign language.

[shiranui]

I just went to 7-11 to get something to eat, and I saw The Playstation 2 version of MP behind the counter. I guess this is what Mika-chan was refering to.

I hope it sells well for you guys.

bye

[biXen]

What j means is that if you listen to System of a Down you listen so crappy music that you HAVE To understand the lyrics images/icons/tongue.gif

Just kidding (well not really). But understanding text in games strikes me as more important than lyrics in songs, but then again I can't understand half of the lyrics in the death metal I listen to anyway images/icons/wink.gif Some of them are pretty good though.

I also think the Japanese are not behind Americans in overclocking, they just don't make so much fuzz on the net as Americans and Europeans do images/icons/smile.gif Quite frankly, there's many nationalities that I have no idea where they are on the net at all. When I look at the stats for Payne Reactor there's people from all over the world, but the only people that contact me, join forums etc. seem to be from those certain 10-15 "normal" countries.

[MikaRMD]

Originally posted by shiranui:
Being an Innocuous subject, I dont really care. But you're all talking out of your asses

Unless you live here, keep your misinformed comments to yourselves.


95% of US games come to Japan
EAs games are usually here less than a month after US releases. Yes, those that have a lot of text in them are localised, but many have a option to install in Japanese or English. EA really excels in this area. anyway I saw Max Payne in the shops here years ago. Maybe it was just subtitled.

Want to see US games? walk into the PC games section of Yodobashi Camera........ <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well, I hope someone gets something out of this conversation...

What I am talking about Western games not making it in Japan is this:
latest console sales (http://www.the-magicbox.com/topten.htm)

best sellers 2002 (http://www.the-magicbox.com/Chart-BestSell2002.htm)

best sellers 2001 (http://www.the-magicbox.com/Chart-BestSell2001.htm)

If 95 % of US games come to Japan, they come to die there.

And no, Max Payne a year ago in Japan would not have been subtitled. Trust me.

[ 05-25-2003, 06:39 PM: Message edited by: MikaRMD ]

[j]

Originally posted by biXen:
What j means is that if you listen to System of a Down you listen so crappy music that you HAVE To understand the lyrics images/icons/tongue.gif <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Sheesh, a guy from Norway (http://www.mortiis.com/) talking about crappy music. Well, being from Norway, atleast you know (http://www.dimmu-borgir.com/) what crappy music (http://www.satyricon.no/) is, since that's pretty much the only kind (http://www.thetruemayhem.com/) of music Norway has (http://kovenant.hypermart.net/) to offer (http://www.burzum.com/).

Go back to pump oil and kill whales, codrocker images/icons/tongue.gif

Disclaimer: Please note the http://forums.3drealms.com/ubb/icons/icon119.gif-message icon.

[ 05-25-2003, 06:49 PM: Message edited by: j ]

[biXen]

j: you did everyone a favour there by listing all the good bands from Scandinavia, minus Burzum which I don't like images/icons/wink.gif

shiranui: you sure you weren't in a completely different store browsing out some Max Payne related stuff? Maybe not images/icons/tongue.gif

[shiranui]

Mika-chan, I was not having a go at you btw.

You said "not many games make it TO the Japanese market". This is not true.

If you had said: "not many games make it IN the Japanese market" it might make more sense. However western FPS and RTS are very popular over here.

Console-wise however, no US games cannot compete, the market is flooded with games from the big developers.

Next time im in town ill check out the old MP box I saw ages ago and see what it is.

[Joe Siegler]

Originally posted by MikaRMD:
I don't know. That's only what I hear. Why do you think Western computer games have difficulties in penetrating the Japanese market? Lack of marketing? Lack of understanding the consumers? Cultural differences? Naturally the language is just one thing. <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I'd say cultural - there's some fundametal differences (as well as a lot of similarities) between American & Japanese culture - or at least that's been my observation.

There's a gob of Japanese games that aren't released over here - most don't seem to "translate", and I'm not talking about language.

Story mode in Super Monkey Ball 2 is an example - it's really "goofy" when translated to English - it's almost Engrish in it's usage of the English language.

[shiranui]

Thank you Joseph images/icons/grin.gif

As I thought, Max Payne has indeed been on sale in Japan since July 11th 2001.

It was the original English version:

Max Payne for 6800 yen (http://www.yodobashi.com/enjoy/i.jsp?oid=37495)

[xZero]

Apparently Max had a pretty good start in Japan. It deputed at n:3 in last weeks chart. Although now it's dropped off the top10.
Anyway I don't think it's too usual for western game to deput so high in Japan.
Saw that posted in VE3d last week.

[SkavenRMD]

Maybe Max would sell better in Japan if we made him speak in happy falsetto voice, exclaiming "woopee" or "yippee" every time he jumps?

And when he finds a new gun, you'd see a camera spin with Max lifting the (radiantly glowing and spinning) gun above his head:

Gun get!

Plus of course the special features posted earlier... *searches frantically to link* ... *gives up* okay, here goes again:

Every time you activate Bullet Time, you would see a cutscene where the background turns into a radial blur, Max raises his arms, emits a glowing yellow aura and yells in an echoing voice, "Bulettooooo timoooooooo!!". Yes, every single time, all the way through the game.

And every time you shoot-dodge, the background would turn into a blur of lines and Max would exclaim, "Shüüüüüüt-Dodgerüüüüü!!!" ... in an echoing voice.

Mona Sax would be wearing a schoolgirl outfit, have fluorescent pink hair and speak in a shrill hyperactive tone. After drinking that glass of champagne, no, guzzling the entire bottle of champagne, she would emit a white champignon-looking thingy from her mouth.

A droplet of sweat the size of a pear will appear on the back of Frankie's head when Max arrives to the bar.

With this brilliant strategy, we will gloriously conquer the Japanese market! Hai!

[j]

Originally posted by SkavenRMD:
With this brilliant strategy, we will gloriously conquer the Japanese market! Hai! <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">No you won't, as I've pointed out before, Viewtiful Joe (http://cube.ign.com/objects/495/495479.html) does all that already. And I don't think you foreign devils can compete with homebred products.


Yes. They really do make games like that.

[motionblur]

I smell a cool mod images/icons/wink.gif

(somebody please do it..... images/icons/grin.gif images/icons/grin.gif images/icons/grin.gif images/icons/grin.gif images/icons/grin.gif )

[motionblur]

Originally posted by SkavenRMD:
Mona Sax would be wearing a schoolgirl outfit, have fluorescent pink hair and speak in a shrill hyperactive tone. After drinking that glass of champagne, no, guzzling the entire bottle of champagne, she would emit a white champignon-looking thingy from her mouth.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Actually this sounds so cool, that I just had to do a quick Photoshoping of that images/icons/grin.gif
http://motionblur.bei.t-online.de/ubbpics/mangapayne.jpg

Please make that a bonus mode in Max Payne 2 ... images/icons/smile.gif

[RollingBrass]

Skaven...You, sir, are a sheer delight. images/icons/grin.gif

[Kev_Hectic]

Originally posted by SkavenRMD:
Maybe Max would sell better in Japan if we made him speak in happy falsetto voice, exclaiming "woopee" or "yippee" every time he jumps?

And when he finds a new gun, you'd see a camera spin with Max lifting the (radiantly glowing and spinning) gun above his head:

Gun get!

Plus of course the special features posted earlier... *searches frantically to link* ... *gives up* okay, here goes again:

Every time you activate Bullet Time, you would see a cutscene where the background turns into a radial blur, Max raises his arms, emits a glowing yellow aura and yells in an echoing voice, "Bulettooooo timoooooooo!!". Yes, every single time, all the way through the game.

And every time you shoot-dodge, the background would turn into a blur of lines and Max would exclaim, "Shüüüüüüt-Dodgerüüüüü!!!" ... in an echoing voice.

Mona Sax would be wearing a schoolgirl outfit, have fluorescent pink hair and speak in a shrill hyperactive tone. After drinking that glass of champagne, no, guzzling the entire bottle of champagne, she would emit a white champignon-looking thingy from her mouth.

A droplet of sweat the size of a pear will appear on the back of Frankie's head when Max arrives to the bar.

With this brilliant strategy, we will gloriously conquer the Japanese market! Hai! <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Or you could've renamed the game "Dragon Warrior: Max Payne edition" (or something like that) and people would've camped out side of game stores months in advance in its anticipation.

...Or am I wrong in thinking the Dragon Warrior name has huge recognition in Japan?