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Old 11-03-2008, 10:24 AM   #1
divinity
Lightbulb Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
Hey,

whats about the mouse feeling in DNF ? I heard that DNF will also be released for consoles. Most games do have this shitty mousefeeling like swimming in syrup. Like playing with a joypad, you know ? Hope it will be straight and direct like in Prey or CS 1.6. Played Farcry2 a while ago, but sold it again, because of the annoying gameplay AND the weird mousefeeling. Please dont make a mistake like that

And about the enemies, when you see a horde of pigs, that they dont have the same amount of hitpoints. So when i shot PIG1 with 5 bullets in the chest, it wouldnt be the same on PIG2, who only needs 3 shots to collapse. That would be far more fun. =)

Also it would be cool to hear some reorchestrated tracks from older Duke Nukem games, for example DN2, the first level or so, would be very cool
Is there a chance to get this?

edit: and i want to see the old apogee logo before the intro starts
Last edited by divinity; 11-03-2008 at 12:21 PM.
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Old 11-03-2008, 02:29 PM   #2
prophecy holder

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Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
Im sorry but they will probably not do the apogee logo. Its 3D Realms logo they will be using. You know people will think that 3D Realms gave up on DNF and gave it to Apogee (there the same company but a lot of people don't know that lol).
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Old 11-03-2008, 04:07 PM   #3
divinity
Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
haha

i did think about 3DRealms logo first, then Apogee.
Or Apogee first, like in the good ol' times

Would be a nice present for us since-1st hour fans
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Old 11-05-2008, 09:15 PM   #4
Angilion
Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
Try buying Resident Evil 4 for PC. In comparison with that, a sluggish, pseudo-joypad mouse response will seem excellent.

RE4 was ported from PS2 to PC with such a stunning degree of incompetence that it beggars belief. Giving a game to schoolchildren to convert as part of their schoolwork might yield better results. Mouse support...isn't. None at all. The game only works with a gamepad and makes heavy use of onscreen prompts for button-presses...which are specific to the PS2 controller. You need to apply patches made by fans to make the game at all playable.
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Old 11-06-2008, 09:50 AM   #5
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Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
It would be cool if the Apogee logo was in the title screens. Or at least put some nice Apogee logos on the walls in the offices in the game. Like how in F.E.A.R. if you look at the mail sitting on the office desks, you'll see envelopes clearly addressed to Monolith Productions, very cool and a lot of fun.
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Old 11-06-2008, 10:00 AM   #6
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Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
Quote:
Originally Posted by Angilion View Post
Try buying Resident Evil 4 for PC. In comparison with that, a sluggish, pseudo-joypad mouse response will seem excellent.

RE4 was ported from PS2 to PC with such a stunning degree of incompetence that it beggars belief. Giving a game to schoolchildren to convert as part of their schoolwork might yield better results. Mouse support...isn't. None at all. The game only works with a gamepad and makes heavy use of onscreen prompts for button-presses...which are specific to the PS2 controller. You need to apply patches made by fans to make the game at all playable.
Thats the problem with computers, seems that the only games that play good on it are FPS, point and clickers, RTS type games. It should of just stayed on the gamecube.
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Old 11-06-2008, 12:48 PM   #7
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Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
Quote:
Originally Posted by divinity View Post
Hey,

whats about the mouse feeling in DNF ? I heard that DNF will also be released for consoles. Most games do have this shitty mousefeeling like swimming in syrup. Like playing with a joypad, you know ? Hope it will be straight and direct like in Prey or CS 1.6. Played Farcry2 a while ago, but sold it again, because of the annoying gameplay AND the weird mousefeeling. Please dont make a mistake like that
You do know that pretty much EVERY game out there has a plethora of options for adjusting the mouse? To sell a game because you can't be bothered to adjust the mouse settings is kinda sad...
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Old 11-06-2008, 01:07 PM   #8
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Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
I understand what is being said here and i agree about the "Walking in syrup" feeling, i hate that and it is so common now too, as long as I can switch the mouse to keyboard only somehow i will be happy, but either way, the game will undoubtedly be cool.
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Old 11-07-2008, 07:05 PM   #9
Angilion
Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
Quote:
Originally Posted by prophecy holder View Post
Thats the problem with computers, seems that the only games that play good on it are FPS, point and clickers, RTS type games. It should of just stayed on the gamecube.
All types of games play well on a PC, if they're written properly. The issue is extremely poor conversions between platforms. RE4 could be better on a PC than a console if it was written properly, and mods from fans do help a lot.

There's nothing a console can do that a PC can't. The issues with the PC version of RE4 are solely due to staggeringly incompetent porting.
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Old 11-10-2008, 02:02 AM   #10
Smackerlacker
Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
If you're getting poor mouse response it is undoubtedly caused by either having a pathetic CPU that can't process input fast enough, or you just need to upgrade your mouse drivers. Most people really overlook how important mouse drivers are I think. Oh, one more thing. If you're mouse is plugged into a USB port, than all I can do is point and laugh at you. Also, mice suck! Trackballs FTW!
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Old 11-13-2008, 02:21 AM   #11
Angilion
Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
The idea that any vaguely modern CPU can't handle mouse input is frankly ludicrous. Also, please explain why USB is a problem for mice now. PS/2 is, as far as I can determine from very old sources, a 12KHz 8-bit connection. 96Kbps bandwidth. As opposed to 480Mbps for USB. 0.02% of a USB2.0 connection gives as much bandwidth as a PS/2 connection.

Obviously, it's more complex than that, but I don't see how USB2.0 is as inferior to PS/2 for mice as you claim it is.

Trackballs and mice...well, that's personal preference.
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Old 11-13-2008, 01:19 PM   #12
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Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
Quote:
Originally Posted by Angilion View Post
The idea that any vaguely modern CPU can't handle mouse input is frankly ludicrous. Also, please explain why USB is a problem for mice now. PS/2 is, as far as I can determine from very old sources, a 12KHz 8-bit connection. 96Kbps bandwidth. As opposed to 480Mbps for USB. 0.02% of a USB2.0 connection gives as much bandwidth as a PS/2 connection.

Obviously, it's more complex than that, but I don't see how USB2.0 is as inferior to PS/2 for mice as you claim it is.

Trackballs and mice...well, that's personal preference.
Because PS/2 Mouse Port is a dedicated mouse port, the bandwidth etc is enough for a mouse, USB has a slower response time on mice, not sure why but it just is - probably the complexity and all the Plug and Play, it is possible to convert the mouse to PS/2 so i doubt that its using the USB to it's full potential, also the USB mouse does seem to have a higher load on the system.
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Old 11-13-2008, 03:32 PM   #13
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Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
Quote:
Originally Posted by Angilion View Post
The idea that any vaguely modern CPU can't handle mouse input is frankly ludicrous.
Not necessarily. If a PC is under a heavy load, be it on the CPU or on the GPU, there can be a massive delay between when you move the mouse in the real word, and when the game being played actually carries out that movement.
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Old 11-13-2008, 04:55 PM   #14
DuLt
Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
Why can't we fit a pc with a DECENT controller so we could play console games on the pc without needing to buy a whole new system?
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Old 11-13-2008, 07:34 PM   #15
Angilion
Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
Quote:
Originally Posted by hightreason View Post
Because PS/2 Mouse Port is a dedicated mouse port, the bandwidth etc is enough for a mouse, USB has a slower response time on mice, not sure why but it just is - probably the complexity and all the Plug and Play, it is possible to convert the mouse to PS/2 so i doubt that its using the USB to it's full potential, also the USB mouse does seem to have a higher load on the system.
You can plug a USB mouse into a PS/2 port. All it takes is a simple little converter.

I haven't noticed any difference at all. I've tried PS/2 mice, USB mice in a PS/2 port and USB mice in USB ports. No difference.
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Old 11-13-2008, 07:39 PM   #16
Angilion
Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
Quote:
Originally Posted by StrikerMan780 View Post
Not necessarily. If a PC is under a heavy load, be it on the CPU or on the GPU, there can be a massive delay between when you move the mouse in the real word, and when the game being played actually carries out that movement.
That isn't because the CPU can't handle mouse input, though. It's because of a bottleneck somewhere, caused by something else.

It's like having a traffic jam of a thousand lorries and saying that the road can't handle the bicycle stuck behind the lorries.
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Old 11-13-2008, 07:41 PM   #17
Angilion
Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuLt View Post
Why can't we fit a pc with a DECENT controller so we could play console games on the pc without needing to buy a whole new system?
What's stopping you fitting a console-style gamepad to a PC? It will be inferior to a mouse and keyboard, but it will let you play games that have been designed solely for a gamepad and badly ported to PC.
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Old 11-14-2008, 10:21 AM   #18
divinity
Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
cmon, i wouldnt have this posted here, if i wasnt informed about computers.

i'm not really talking about mouselags..

my drivers for the hardware are always up to date.. got an fetish here
i got mouse acceleration fix, which works as an workaround. the acceleration which is in the registry, is ignored, with this fix.

also the all known CPL fix doesnt fix that.
Its not a lack of power on my processor

Dont have this even in Crysis.

Farcry2 feels like shit and you COULDNT adjust the mousesettings. even if "mouse smoothing" is 0 (in menu and config), mouse acceleration still feels like a analog stick from a joypad. Call of Duty - World at War, feels nearly great.
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Old 11-15-2008, 09:17 AM   #19
DuLt
Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
Quote:
Originally Posted by Angilion View Post
What's stopping you fitting a console-style gamepad to a PC? It will be inferior to a mouse and keyboard, but it will let you play games that have been designed solely for a gamepad and badly ported to PC.
Yeah... instead of making "consoles", they could focus their minds on making a console/computer. Example:
Wii with keyboard and wiimote as mouse. You get home, turn on the tv, put the tv on one side and resize it, then open mail, get keyboard out an write.
If by any chance you had a ps3 pc you could play games with mouse or gamepad...
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Old 11-15-2008, 09:43 AM   #20
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Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
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Originally Posted by Smackerlacker View Post
If you're getting poor mouse response it is undoubtedly caused by either having a pathetic CPU that can't process input fast enough, or you just need to upgrade your mouse drivers.
I dont know. To me it seems to be certain game engines just have this flaw. For instance anything on a solid engine like an Unreal or a Carmack engine will always play flawlessly on any system I've had.
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Old 11-15-2008, 02:48 PM   #21
Angilion
Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuLt View Post
Yeah... instead of making "consoles", they could focus their minds on making a console/computer. Example:
Wii with keyboard and wiimote as mouse. You get home, turn on the tv, put the tv on one side and resize it, then open mail, get keyboard out an write.
If by any chance you had a ps3 pc you could play games with mouse or gamepad...
That could be done very easily. A console is a computer, obviously. The console manufacturers have to go to some lengths to stop general-purpose operating systems being run on them. The console manufacturers are deliberately not adding more general functionality to consoles. Although Sony does give some degree of support to the idea of using a PS3 as a general-purpose PC. It is possible to install Linux on a PS3 and also to add a mouse and keyboard, so that will do the job.

Consoles are sold more or less at cost, or even at a loss. That's a large part of the reason why they are relatively cheap. The profit is in the games. So console companies don't want people to buy consoles to use them as general-purpose computers.

Given that game publishers are generally trying to kill the second hand market for PC games (which I think will gut the market for new PC games) and often make using new games troublesome for legitimate buyers, I am seriously considering not upgrading my PC again and instead switching to a PS3 that I'll install Linux on. The only thing I can do under Windows that I can't do under Linux is play games, which would be handled by running Linux on a PS3.
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Old 11-15-2008, 04:31 PM   #22
Danule

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Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
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Originally Posted by hightreason View Post
Because PS/2 Mouse Port is a dedicated mouse port, the bandwidth etc is enough for a mouse, USB has a slower response time on mice, not sure why but it just is - probably the complexity and all the Plug and Play, it is possible to convert the mouse to PS/2 so i doubt that its using the USB to it's full potential, also the USB mouse does seem to have a higher load on the system.
you just have a shitty mouse man. the response time for my mouse which is USB has a 1ms response time
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Old 11-15-2008, 04:32 PM   #23
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Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
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I dont know. To me it seems to be certain game engines just have this flaw. For instance anything on a solid engine like an Unreal or a Carmack engine will always play flawlessly on any system I've had.
bioshock was made on unreal and it has a floaty mouse...
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Old 11-15-2008, 06:46 PM   #24
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Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
From the sounds of this thread, no one here has ever heard of ADJUSTING the in game mouse settings.
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Old 11-15-2008, 08:44 PM   #25
Nessus

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Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
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Originally Posted by Nukkus View Post
From the sounds of this thread, no one here has ever heard of ADJUSTING the in game mouse settings.
We're talking about lag not speed adjustment.
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Old 11-16-2008, 07:15 PM   #26
Nukkus

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Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
dude. if your mouse lags, you turn up the accelleration.
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Old 11-16-2008, 10:14 PM   #27
divinity
Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
holy crap. nobody wants acceleration. and NOBODY in the pro-scene plays with it. and for your home office computer, where you could be glad, when duke nukem 3d works smooth, sure.. there would acceleration makes sense. go away buddy
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Old 11-17-2008, 01:17 PM   #28
Nukkus

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Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
I don't have a home office computer, I have a dedicated gaming machine that I built myself.
Anyway, if your mouse is lagging, then there are a number of possible things that can be causing it. Improper settings, outdated drivers, or maybe it could be time to toss out that old ball mouse.

Anyway, if you have a Logitech or a Razer mouse, without the latest drivers installed your mouse is gonna be awful. And if you have the brushed steel Logitech G5, make sure you've updated the firmware, otherwise it'll be really choppy. After all that is taken care of, tweak the game settings until the mouse feels just right.
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Old 11-18-2008, 04:58 PM   #29
DuLt
Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
Quote:
Originally Posted by Angilion View Post
That could be done very easily. A console is a computer, obviously. The console manufacturers have to go to some lengths to stop general-purpose operating systems being run on them. The console manufacturers are deliberately not adding more general functionality to consoles. Although Sony does give some degree of support to the idea of using a PS3 as a general-purpose PC. It is possible to install Linux on a PS3 and also to add a mouse and keyboard, so that will do the job.

Consoles are sold more or less at cost, or even at a loss. That's a large part of the reason why they are relatively cheap. The profit is in the games. So console companies don't want people to buy consoles to use them as general-purpose computers.

Given that game publishers are generally trying to kill the second hand market for PC games (which I think will gut the market for new PC games) and often make using new games troublesome for legitimate buyers, I am seriously considering not upgrading my PC again and instead switching to a PS3 that I'll install Linux on. The only thing I can do under Windows that I can't do under Linux is play games, which would be handled by running Linux on a PS3.
I keep saying that if you cut prices you'll cut piracy to a certain extent...
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Old 11-24-2008, 05:12 PM   #30
Danule

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Re: Mouse Acceleration + Nostalgia + Random HP
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nukkus View Post
I don't have a home office computer, I have a dedicated gaming machine that I built myself.
Anyway, if your mouse is lagging, then there are a number of possible things that can be causing it. Improper settings, outdated drivers, or maybe it could be time to toss out that old ball mouse.

Anyway, if you have a Logitech or a Razer mouse, without the latest drivers installed your mouse is gonna be awful. And if you have the brushed steel Logitech G5, make sure you've updated the firmware, otherwise it'll be really choppy. After all that is taken care of, tweak the game settings until the mouse feels just right.
some games just have a laggy mouse my friend.
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