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Old 04-03-2004, 02:04 PM   #1
Acleacius
3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
Its all over the web looks like Randy Smith is for hire.
I hope you have condisered it, as the quality 3DRealms put out, it would be an incredible match
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Old 04-03-2004, 02:46 PM   #2
Simon Charles

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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
I think George hates games where you have to sneak around and one alarm means "game over". So it's doubtful 3DR would ever design such games.
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Old 04-03-2004, 02:50 PM   #3
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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
Yeah, we don't want another RtCW with DNF, I can guarantee you, the one reason that some of the levels in RtCW sucked was because of that very reason, you had to keep from distracting the Nazis so they couldn't radio any bases, or pull any alarms and fail your mission. Also, you couldn't kill any civilians with the red no signs on them, either, or you'd fail a mission. I don't see DNF ever playing like a game like that at all! I want a no holds barred, frag 'em all, winner take all, and finish the level, and be done type of game, THAT's what makes Duke, not like James Bond or B.J. Blaskowicz, blech, you need a great hero, and great action where anything that's everything and everybody is not safe from Duke's style of play...
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Old 04-03-2004, 03:34 PM   #4
Warmaster129
Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
I want to be able to sneak around, but there's no penalty for running out guns-a-blazing. Far Cry did that okay, you could go out into battle, or you could sneak past everybody to the mounted minigun up above and blow them all to hell from there.
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Old 04-03-2004, 04:03 PM   #5
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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
NO SNEAKING!
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Old 04-03-2004, 04:04 PM   #6
NutWrench

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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
NOLF 2 was my favourite game for sneaking.
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Old 04-03-2004, 04:11 PM   #7
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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
Quote:
I think George hates games where you have to sneak around and one alarm means "game over". So it's doubtful 3DR would ever design such games.
Simon is correct. We won't see levels requiring a stealth approach. I would like to see AI sophisticated enough that a person could "hide" and "sneak" if he wanted to. If you don't enter an enemy's cone of vision, or make noise enough to be heard, the enemy shouldn't know where you are.
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Old 04-03-2004, 04:52 PM   #8
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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
Although I wouldnt like to see a sneaking game, I also would be dissapointed if it was a Painkiller type run and gun shooter...I want a little more depth than that. Duke 3D was just perfect, so long as they stick the same formula, and the moderated gratutuitus violence, im happy
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Old 04-03-2004, 04:53 PM   #9
vivftp
Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
Actually, I think if 3DR ever made a game along the lines of Deus Ex, then it could possibly be one of the best games of all times! I don't know how good they are at making up a story and implementing it, but the amount of effort they put into their games - the sheer amount of interactivity, EVERYTHING they put forward in their games THAT could make this type of game a monster success.

I dunno what it is, but for a long time, ever since I played Deus Ex, I always wondered what it would be like if 3DR produced it.
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Old 04-03-2004, 05:01 PM   #10
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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of ga
Quote:
Actually, I think if 3DR ever made a game along the lines of Deus Ex, then it could possibly be one of the best games of all times! I don't know how good they are at making up a story and implementing it, but the amount of effort they put into their games - the sheer amount of interactivity, EVERYTHING they put forward in their games THAT could make this type of game a monster success.

I dunno what it is, but for a long time, ever since I played Deus Ex, I always wondered what it would be like if 3DR produced it.
DNF will be the best game of all time.
 
Old 04-03-2004, 05:17 PM   #11
Arkhangel

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Sneaking type of games = bad
There are far too many sneaking-type games out right now.

Hitman, Splinter Cell, MGS, and Thief just to name a few.

No thanks. I'd much prefer a good old well-done balls-to-the-wall shoot 'em up game. \o/
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Old 04-03-2004, 05:31 PM   #12
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Re: Sneaking type of games = bad
Quote:
There are far too many sneaking-type games out right now.

Hitman, Splinter Cell, MGS, and Thief just to name a few.

No thanks. I'd much prefer a good old well-done balls-to-the-wall shoot 'em up game. \o/
If so, aren't there too many run-n-gun shooters? I think the amount of sneaker games is just right.
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Old 04-03-2004, 09:02 PM   #13
Gideon

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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
Sneaking games are made by sneaky people for sneaky people. It's hard to trust a sneaky person cuz they're so damn sneaky. 3DR isn't sneaky, they're secrative, and that's a whole other ballgame.

Does this sound like fun to you?

o.k. Let's sneak over there and make sure nobody sees us. That way, we won't have to interact with any NPC's and the whole game can be spent sneaking around. If they see me, that's a "Bad thing" that would be interactive, and you can't have interactivity in a sneaky game, unless your interacting with shadows or crawling through ventilation shafts. Uh oh, if that guard see's me he's gonna sound the alarm and that means game over. I'll have to sneak all the way back here and sneak differently this time around.

Sneaking around isn't a game, it's burglery practice.

the original Deus Ex handled it differently, you could sneak around or kill everybody. That gives the sneaky people the option to sneak, while still giving the cool people of the world a chance to blast everything in sight.
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Old 04-03-2004, 10:29 PM   #14
Acleacius
Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of ga
I was thinking also that if 3DRealms did one it would be great im surprised so many of you doubt thier skillz

Well if GB hates them, then there is no chance.
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Old 04-03-2004, 11:39 PM   #15
Arkhangel

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Re: Sneaking type of games = bad
Quote:
Quote:
I'd much prefer a good old well-done balls-to-the-wall shoot 'em up game. \o/
If so, aren't there too many run-n-gun shooters? I think the amount of sneaker games is just right.
I think there are too many poorly-done run-n-gun shooters. That's why I added "well-done" to my comment. There are quite a few shooters that have come out that weren't necessarily bad games (SOF2 for example), there just wasn't anything particularly remarkable about any of them.

That's why I'm pretty excited about a large part of the crop of upcoming games. They look to possible break the mold.
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Old 04-04-2004, 03:02 AM   #16
Daedalus
 
Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of ga
Quote:
NO SNEAKING!
I am the sneaky sneaker. I hide in the shadows, wait for my prey and attack from behind. Snipers are no match for my wickedness. Bwhahahaaa, join my deathmatch and you lose, pal.

Sneaking rules! (at least in multiplayer)

- "Watch out! There is a sneaker on the roofs!!!!
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Old 04-04-2004, 05:12 AM   #17
alessnet

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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
NO SNEAKING!
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Old 04-04-2004, 05:25 AM   #18
Klaus Kinski

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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
Quote:
I think George hates games where you have to sneak around and one alarm means "game over". So it's doubtful 3DR would ever design such games.
In Thief it was never "game over" when I f*cked up.
That's just bad game design, nothing that speaks against stealth.
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Old 04-04-2004, 05:33 AM   #19
Tjals
Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
Imagine a room, low ceiling, lots of obstacles, dim light, slimy walls and packed with pig cops and octa-brains...

EITHER,

1. Duke could shoot a ventilation shaft and quitely crawl unnoticedly over the heads of the family picknick beneath him.


OR,

2. Duke could could lob in a few pipeboms, detonate them right after the first sharp cries, jump in creating havock with an rpg, then turn to his ripper to take out the last alien scumbags and take a moment to enjoy the sight of what's left of them (Heheh, What a mess!), all of this - of course - while carefully avoiding to hit the three babes that were held hostage, free them and get jiggy with 'em...


Now, which of these two options do you think Duke would prefer, eh?
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Old 04-04-2004, 05:35 AM   #20
Daedalus
 
Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of ga
Quote:
Quote:
I think George hates games where you have to sneak around and one alarm means "game over". So it's doubtful 3DR would ever design such games.
In Thief it was never "game over" when I f*cked up.
That's just bad game design, nothing that speaks against stealth.
Exactly.

Plus, a well designed game gives the player the choice whether to use direct attack or stealth tactics to accomplish a mission. See Thief 1, 2, System Shock 2, Deus Ex 1, etc.

The "game over" counter-argument is just used by people who have no f**kin' clue how to play in stealth mode imho.
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Old 04-04-2004, 05:47 AM   #21
Gideon

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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of ga
I think we all have an idea how to use stealth tactics, I think there are many people that don't care for that particular type of game.

Like I said earlier, Deus Ex did it right. Sneaking should be an option, not always the main tactic.
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Old 04-04-2004, 05:48 AM   #22
EMaz
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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
Duke being sneaky??? I don't think it's his style. Is comments like "The last thing that goes through your mind before you die....is my size 13 boot" or "It's time to kick ass and chew bublegum" comming from a stealthy guy??? Duke prefer an open combat (also the only way to put the comments to the aliens face(s)).

Don't get my wrong though; I like stealthy games like NOFL 1 and 2 and Deus Ex, but Duke Nukem is not a subtle guy... he likes to show off.
 
Old 04-04-2004, 06:08 AM   #23
Daedalus
 
Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of ga
Quote:
Duke being sneaky??? I don't think it's his style.
Ofcourse sneaking is not Duke's style. We were only talking about sneaking in general, no relation to any title whatever. At least that was what I did in my previous posts.

Besides, the subject of this thread reads "3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?" and not "3Drealms ever considered Sneaking in DNF?".

Again, that was how I understood this thread in the first place. Maybe I was wrong. Maybe it is about sneaking in DNF. In that case I have to agree with the people who don't want any sneaking in DNF, for the above reasons mentioned: it's not Duke's style.

However, sneaking is cool in other games, especially in Thief 1,2. And it would be great if 3DR ever designed a sneaking-type of game (after they release DNF ofcourse).
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Old 04-04-2004, 08:47 AM   #24
Simon Charles

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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
Quote:
Quote:
I think George hates games where you have to sneak around and one alarm means "game over". So it's doubtful 3DR would ever design such games.
In Thief it was never "game over" when I f*cked up.
That's just bad game design, nothing that speaks against stealth.

I'm just quoting George; not talking about a specific game.
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Old 04-04-2004, 09:04 AM   #25
Acleacius
Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of ga
Yeah it was meant as a possible future project, with possibly Randy Smith.
Its just I get the impression that GB recognizes, creates and likes to work with quality.
Some of the greatest games have had sneaking as a posssiblity, as mentioned before Thief 1, Thief 2, System Shock 1(I think), System Shock 2 and more.
Heck if DNF makes only half the immpression, he made with his last game it will still be a classic, maybe they only want to do Duke games, thats fine by me.
It just seems take Max Payne, 3DR invested time, ideas and money into MP. MP became a great franchise.
Good Lord NoBody thinks Duke is a Sneaker, he is a one man Nuclear Bomb and he anit afraid to use it
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Old 04-04-2004, 02:33 PM   #26
Kalki

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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
An entire game involving sneaking? NO!

A blown alarm causing a game-over?? HELL-NO!

Limited perception for enemies in how much they can see and hear? The ability to exploit that? Yes!

Gameplay allowing the player to get close enough to such an enemy with the interactive melee object-weaponry that the game would provide, without making them as defensively capable as JK's lightsabre? Yes.

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Old 04-04-2004, 07:15 PM   #27
JimboC

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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
Quote:
NOLF 2 was my favourite game for sneaking.
Funny, that's the same reson I stopped playing it.

I would very much like the type of design where you can choose how to approach each situation. I hate the levels in games where you HAVE to do exactly what the level designer wanted or you loose.

I also really hate it when you decide to sneak around so as to not alert the enemy, but some half-witted computer-controlled side-kick decides to go in guns blazing. If it's a single player game, it should be a single player game. Leave to side-kicks for co-op and multiplayer. And let the player play the way they like.
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Old 04-04-2004, 08:33 PM   #28
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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
Say what you will, but the image of the steroid-pumped, one-liner blasting Duke Nukem sneaking past enemies, worried about getting his ass getting blasted and crawling in the shadows is seriously cracking me up.
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Old 04-05-2004, 02:32 AM   #29
Mobay
Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
Quote:
Its all over the web looks like Randy Smith is for hire.
I hope you have condisered it, as the quality 3DRealms put out, it would be an incredible match

Duke nukem is a game about every thing oposite to sneaking!



Sorry 4 bad spelling
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Old 04-05-2004, 02:35 AM   #30
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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
I ones played a sneaking game, I remained alive and undetected for about 5 min. and than I had enough of it and blasted everyone in sight. (which lasted about 10 sec because I shot an npc.

moral of the storie: I HATE SNEAKING GAMES AND SNEAKING IN GAMES. SO NOOOOOOOO SNEAKING!!!!!

just my humble opinion.
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Old 04-05-2004, 02:56 AM   #31
IHerman
Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
Duke solves his problems with violence.

Sneaking around is for pussies.

I totally agree with JimboC.

It's a single player game, for god's sake don't make me protect or cooperate with some sidekick. Unless it doesn't matter if he/she dies. That would actually be fun.

After 15 minutes of ass-saving the sidekick finally gets killed:
"Damn, ah well, there's always some collateral damage in alien ass-kicking."
And you can simply continue.
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Old 04-05-2004, 07:19 AM   #32
mysteryperfecta

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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
A lot of people are poo-pooing sneaking, but a lot of fantastic games have employed the tactic. You wouldn't say that JC Denton and Sam Fisher were wimps for employing this tactic? I assume then that leaning around corners is for wussies too?

I agree: no forced sneaking. But as Kalki and I have stated, acceptably-sophisticated AI, by it's very nature, would allow for sneaking/hiding. I disagree that Duke wouldn't sneak, in specific circumstances. What do you think crawling in vents is? In fact, he will sneak when I'm controlling him (when tactically advantageous).
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Old 04-05-2004, 07:45 AM   #33
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Re: 3Drealms ever considered a Sneaking type of game?
It would also be quite nice if you were given the opportunity to survey certain 'strongholds' before attacking la Far Cry, so you could plan possible attack routes or just get yourself mentally prepared for the ensuing carnage.

Dropping in from a vent and painting the walls with blood might be your reward for stealthing the first part of a mission.
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