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Old 05-15-2008, 04:43 AM   #41
Dimebog

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
I haven't thought that, because, out of your 7 posts here, 4 were in some malicious response to me. The ratio is similar on the other forums as well.

So if you don't mean to answer, just stop and that's it.
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Old 05-15-2008, 09:07 AM   #42
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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
he meant that he was quoteing someone else, not you.

im sorry if i overreacted, i just felt bad that tx was being attacked in that way when the enhacements in mapster32 are so obvious. i think that before talking bad, one should spend more time with the editor and then make up their mind.

but thats offtopic now isnt it.

i would really like the different wall color for first walls! definitely a must!
isn't there a way to lock a first wall? because when you make a new wall that instantly becomes the first wall, its annoying!
 
Old 05-15-2008, 12:06 PM   #43
LipSheZ

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Quote:
Originally Posted by timothy2 View Post
i would really like the different wall color for first walls! definitely a must! isn't there a way to lock a first wall? because when you make a new wall that instantly becomes the first wall, its annoying!
I asked about "first walls", but there was not any answer from developers yet. Is it possible to add italicizing first walls with discernible colours or NOT? Esteemed developers, where are you? Please say what you think about our suggestions (by LipSheZ, The Commander, timothy2). We'd like to hear your opinion.

Please direct your attention to some of ideas:
Your comments?
Last edited by LipSheZ; 05-15-2008 at 12:09 PM.
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Old 05-15-2008, 12:41 PM   #44
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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
There's some important stuff in the pipeline for the next snapshot, and for what it's worth I would rather they got that released before they worried about these other requests.
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Old 05-15-2008, 12:54 PM   #45
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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Quote:
the pivoting sector effector should have a little line doing the movement in which the door is going to swwing!
In general, I think there needs to be a quick reference display for all kind of things one is likely to forget or get wrong. I have an idea but haven't started to work on it.

Quote:
SUGGESTION #1: to add optional italicizing displaying of 'first walls' with... yellow coloured lines, for example. This option can be off in menu switched on by F2 key in 3d-mode if mapper doesn't want to see motley wall-lines at that moment. Also it would possible to on first-wall displaying.
Could you elaborate on that? Do you mean firstwalls should be highlighted in 2d or 3d?
I think there are mainly two reasons one wants to know a firstwall: slopes and relative texture alignment, so I suppose you mean 3d mode. Am I right?

Quote:
It would be nice if we could resize floor and ceiling textures, [...]
I think that's mostly an engine thing. There is room yet in the sector structure (correct me if I'm wrong), but the engines would need to know how to render the additional size levels.

Concerning the selection bug, I think it's rather grave. Especially, it makes selecting floors or ceiling impossible (in my experience) when you're more than a certain height above/below it. Looking forward to see the fixed version.
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Old 05-15-2008, 01:43 PM   #46
LipSheZ

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Quote:
Originally Posted by Helixhorned View Post
In general, I think there needs to be a quick reference display for all kind of things one is likely to forget or get wrong. I have an idea but haven't started to work on it.
I count it is very importantly to view tagly linked objects in 2d-mode. Best of all would be to highlight such tag links by thin dotted lines drawn between equal-tagged objects. It can be optional function.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Helixhorned View Post
Do you mean firstwalls should be highlighted in 2d or 3d?
I think there are mainly two reasons one wants to know a firstwall: slopes and relative texture alignment, so I suppose you mean 3d mode. Am I right?
Chiefly 2d mode. Thereat we can see tag-bars and view copious information about sector structures and game objects. But in 3d mode it also will be useful to know where first wall is. Let's fantasize: for example, in imaginary version you can press <predefined> key in 3d mode (let developers to choose this key ) to show all 'first' walls inside of eyeshot by dint of shade twinkling. Helixhorned, does this idea suit you?

Spoiler:
Last edited by LipSheZ; 05-15-2008 at 02:24 PM.
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Old 05-15-2008, 01:48 PM   #47
Dimebog

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Quote:
Originally Posted by Helixhorned View Post
Concerning the selection bug, I think it's rather grave. Especially, it makes selecting floors or ceiling impossible (in my experience) when you're more than a certain height above/below it. Looking forward to see the fixed version.
I too say the bug made editing impossible. However, Hunter_rus has taken care of it, and I think that is the most important part. He also added the quick reference display you mentioned (if that's what you mean), and he fixed the scaling of the clipboard view.

Looks like the next release is going to be really breakthrough, so we should wait a while, and then see if theres some room for improvement/bugs left. I never even considered the fact that there is a 'first wall', since if you get a wrong slope, you just change the Relative alignment. You are still bound to having to do it, no matter if you do or do not know which was the first wall. But I guess for some people it would be more convenient if they could tell where the slope's gonna go before they do it. For me, personally, it doesn't make much of a difference, as long as the 'first wall' indicator doesn't clog the screen or make it harder to spot other details.

One suggestion I'd have would be regarding the F3 mode (mouselook). Like the 'spectate' mode in modern FPS games, your one hand is busy with the mouse, and the other with the arrow keys, so it's a bit awkward having to press A and Z to shift height. I think it would feel more natural if you could travel through all three dimensions when you press forward, depending on your viewing angle, rather than just X and Z (Y being the height). Basically, if you face the ceiling and press forward, you should be moving towards the ceiling. It would also be convenient if for this occasion, left and right arrows would allow one to strife left and right, given that turning is already done via mouse, in this mode.
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Old 05-15-2008, 02:35 PM   #48
LipSheZ

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dimebog View Post
Looks like the next release is going to be really breakthrough
Ooh, it's unquestionably!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dimebog View Post
But I guess for some people it would be more convenient if they could tell where the slope's gonna go before they do it. For me, personally, it doesn't make much of a difference, as long as the 'first wall' indicator doesn't clog the screen or make it harder to spot other details.
You are right! I'd be happy if it is feasible to add this improvement to subsequent Mapster32 versions!
Last edited by LipSheZ; 05-15-2008 at 02:38 PM.
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Old 05-15-2008, 04:10 PM   #49
Helixhorned
Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Quote:
Helixhorned, sorry for nasty question: are you an EDuke32-team developer? I'm pry...
Let's say I'm in the mood of making modifications for Mapster32. For myself
That is, I would be willing to implement others' ideas, but only at a manageable rate and if I consider them worthy of addition.
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Old 05-15-2008, 04:11 PM   #50
Hunter_rus

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
The first wall indication in 2D mode will be available in the next snapshot. Hopefully it took only few minutes to implement. The rest of suggestions will be considered later.
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Old 05-15-2008, 05:44 PM   #51
timothy2
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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
yes! im waiting impatiently for the next snapshot :P

more more!:

-can you fix the grid having too many lines when you zoom in or out error?
- there should be a combination of keeys to run forward in unreal ed navigating mode. i dont want to move the mouse over and over

- i think a node connection between tags would be nice (toggleable of course)
- a quick lonely sector effector finder (to know if there is any before trying the map, i know that an error says the coordinates and stuff but you just lost lots of time by doing that)
- if the keys get too confusing, a "lebuild" type of tool selection could be the solution
- slicer tool! like the one in lebuild, you draw a line that cuts a sector in two by making a red line where you drew it. or a different mode where it only adds vertices where the line crosses other walls


thats all i can come up now :P
 
Old 05-15-2008, 05:48 PM   #52
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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
There is a slicer tool, it is called knowing how to add vertices and draw lines. Also known as reading the FAQ and learning how to use the program.
There are people who made maps 10 years ago on Build that are far better than some of the maps crapped out on UnrealEd or Source by users. Learn how to use the program and make use of its versatility before you go around demanding useless features.

I don't mean to insult you but the idea of a slicer tool is just redundant.
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Old 05-15-2008, 06:08 PM   #53
The Commander

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
He is right there, There wouldnt really need to be a slicer tool for Mapster if you know what your doing.
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Old 05-15-2008, 07:30 PM   #54
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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Fibbles View Post
There is a slicer tool, it is called knowing how to add vertices and draw lines. Also known as reading the FAQ and learning how to use the program.
There are people who made maps 10 years ago on Build that are far better than some of the maps crapped out on UnrealEd or Source by users. Learn how to use the program and make use of its versatility before you go around demanding useless features.

I don't mean to insult you but the idea of a slicer tool is just redundant.
first of all, i dont come fron an unreal community bashing mapster32, which you seem to be thinking here...

second, it isnt redundant, its a time saver, i know it because i mapped for so long (almost 5 years now) , that i know which features can be a good asset.

there are dozens and dozens of features in mapster that are "redundant" but they are there for a reason. for example? the mouse wheel tile changer, you can also change the tile with double pressing "V" , is anyone complaining? no, they thank TX for including a handy feature, which a slicer tool might be. do you mind if i tell you why? look:

1) to do it "old school" you insert a point on a wall, then the wall opposite to it. then you press space twice, each on one of the newly added vertices to make a red line that separates two sectors, im pretty sure you know this as its basic stuff.

2) with a slicer tool, you press space and then space again, done.
same thing, much faster.

want more? ok!

3) if you have weird structures like circled walls and you want to make a stair FAST, just press the space bar on each end of the step for the stair.
same thing, much faster.

more??

4)if you want to make use of the excellent "dynamic light" that deeperthought made, which obviously needs a grid of sectors to work properly. i can tell you from my mind, that a grid sector "old school" would take you at least 5 minutes to make.
doing it with a slicer tool? 5 SECONDS.

unreal ed has nothing to do with anything. I brought that up because the person that made unreal ed navigation for MAPSTER32 (see thread mapster32 modifications here http://forums.3drealms.com/vb/showthread.php?t=31401 ) as you can see, i dont map for unreal, so im not saying its superior or anything (which it obviously is, but i feel at home with mapster32, i like it more).
and i dont see how comparing newbie mappers from unreal to pros for duke3d is any good argument at all...

i dont know about mapping for duke? there wasnt any need for that uninformed and unnecesary comment from you. you know nothing about how much i know about mapster32 but you have to come and make a witty remark about it, great, just great.

whatever else you need to know from me, just ask.
 
Old 05-15-2008, 07:57 PM   #55
Mr.Fibbles

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
I never said UnrealEd was inferior or anything. I am pointing out that in the past users of Build were able to produce better maps than the stuff some kids are crapping out with newer engines because they are lazy and try to use eye candy before content and actual mapping skills.
If you can point to the place where I actually said you used UnrealEd, I would certainly like to see, because I never used the 2nd person in my post. I used the 3rd person the entire time and used indefinite articles because that is the correct way to make a comment and argument without making red herrings or ad hominums.
You should learn how to read posts in their entirety before splurting out accusations.

I happen to find the idea of a slicer tool useless, even in modern engines. I don't map a whole lot but I have mapped in most modern engines and Build for multiple games and I hobby in 3d modeling. I take careful steps to make sure I don't have to risk breaking the map or causing graphical glitches, which often occur from slicer tools and such. I prefer to make my maps/3d works with care and take time on them so they are clean and fresh and without glitches.
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Old 05-15-2008, 09:44 PM   #56
timothy2
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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
i said "it seems youre thinking that" so thats what it seemed to me, not something hard written on stone.

so are you saying yours is the only and correct way?

professionals these days on tutorials often say "im going to teach you my way, but beware that its not the best or only way to do it... just the way I like to do it" which means that good advice is often the one that lets you choose, not the one that is forcing you or telling you that something is wrong.

if a slicer tool makes a graphical glitch, thats because it hasnt been implemented properly into the engine. besides, i also said that there could be a line that inserted vertices across it on any walls it found in its path. doesnt sound too map corrupting to me, does it?.

dont compare a slicer tool on a modern engine to an old engine, apples and oranges. but you know that, do you?

and last but not least, if you dont want to be accused, dont accuse others or imply that they dont know what theyre talking about, and it seems you needed the extra smiley to make your point across as well. well i dont. just admit it, your previous post was pure flamebait from start to finish, even if i were a n00b, would you have to threat me like that? definitely NOT.
 
Old 05-15-2008, 10:58 PM   #57
The Commander

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Ok, Lets not get this thread locked in a flame war ok guys.
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Old 05-16-2008, 12:27 AM   #58
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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
I agree with timothy2 on slicer tool advantages since I often use quick slice tool in 3ds max on city landscapes.
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Old 05-16-2008, 02:33 AM   #59
Dimebog

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
I would prefer to move my vertices before drawing stairs or splitting a room, because sometimes they don't appear where I wanted them to, as I tend to slap them on fast. The slicer tool sounds like something that you would need to be more careful with. Actually it sounds pretty useless, but as I said, I don't mind any feature as long as it doesn't compromise the otherwise simple and effective editor. That means: it doesn't clog the screen with colorful visual artifacts; it doesn't use a keyboard shortcut previously assigned for something else because I don't want to have to get used to the shortcuts after every release.

Also, how do you suppose to lock the slicer to the grid? If you can't do that (and any other way would kinda defeat the purpose), you would just be drawing uneven stairs and splitting uneven rooms, eh?

As for DT's dynamic lighting algorithm - I don't think you really need a grid of sectors. It should work if you place enough vertices on all walls? And I guess, just draw four to six red walls to appear to be casted by pillars, walls, objects and such.
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Old 05-16-2008, 04:08 AM   #60
timothy2
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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
well if you want the effect to be realistic, it has to have the sectors divided as well, but thats for perfectionism. if one likes huge blocks of light, thats his taste i guess .

the slicer tool can be locked to the grid just like when you draw a regular sector. lebuild has it and works pretty good. try it out.

but lets not focus on just one tool, lets just make suggestions and then devs will think if its needed or not.
 
Old 05-16-2008, 07:31 AM   #61
Tea Monster

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Re: Highly annoying Mapster32 bugs
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dimebog View Post
Then I don't understand the claims that Mapster32 is a superior editor or whatever.
ROFLMAO - Wait till you try to track down a light leak on a large level in QERadiant! The BUILD Editor and Mapster32 are some of the best, most intuitive 3D game level editors ever made.
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Old 05-16-2008, 07:38 AM   #62
Dimebog

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
You're telling me?
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Old 06-03-2008, 01:34 AM   #63
TerminX

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Quote:
Originally Posted by timothy2 View Post
-can you fix the grid having too many lines when you zoom in or out error?
This is fixed now.
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Old 06-03-2008, 12:10 PM   #64
timothy2
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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Great thanks!
 
Old 07-01-2008, 01:41 AM   #65
LipSheZ

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
I suggest to make possible to view hi-tag and lo-tag links in 2d mode. Sometimes it's very difficult to find any tag-junctions in a large maps with vast range of tags, so it could be very handy to see thin pulsating blue lines between single-tagged items by pressing predefined key.

For "green users" full suggestion list is here: http://wiki.eduke32.com/wiki/Talk:Th..._and_Mapster32
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Old 07-17-2008, 08:25 AM   #66
XTHX2

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Can I make a suggestion? It's about mapster32.cfg. Can you add a key which changes the sprite editing "F8" ? I saw you showed it on a keyboard-like text graphic, but not defined.
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Old 07-19-2008, 01:34 AM   #67
Mia Max

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Is it possible to set in outdoor areas sprite shade to be dependent on the land but not the sky.
Can you add this to the special functions option?
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Old 07-19-2008, 01:38 AM   #68
DeeperThought

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mia Max View Post
Is it possible to set in outdoor areas sprite shade to be dependent on the land but not the sky.
Can you add this to the special functions option?
The game is hardcoded to make outdoor sprites the shade of the sky. There's nothing that mapster can do about it. I think you can prevent this using the spritenoshade def command, however.
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Old 07-24-2008, 12:17 PM   #69
XTHX2

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
I hope I'm not missing it but I would really like to be able to resize the floor textures, if there isn't a way already.
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Old 07-24-2008, 12:24 PM   #70
Hunter_rus

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
You can't do this. It's a limitation of the Build Engine.
Though you can toggle between two sizes via the E key.
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Old 07-24-2008, 12:29 PM   #71
XTHX2

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Yeah, I know about that. Well, I wish it wasn't a limitation
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Old 07-24-2008, 04:57 PM   #72
The Commander

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
I already asked about this awhile back and I think it has something to do with the angling of slopes that wont allow this. But I stand to be corrected by Hunter.
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Old 07-24-2008, 05:47 PM   #73
Hunter_rus

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
I don't actually aware of the angling of slopes thing or I forgot having read about it. I don't know.
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Old 07-28-2008, 06:19 AM   #74
Spiker

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Can someone finally make stuff (monsters, weapons etc) appear in mapster having the proper size (size that they will be dispalyed in game). Because usually many things are oversized when you put them in and in case of monsters even reloading of a map doesn't help. Sometimes it makes difficult to set proper proportions.
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Old 07-28-2008, 06:25 AM   #75
XTHX2

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Hmm, can I ask how those animations at build are made? I mean, you put a monster and it does it's moving frames... I would like to know how is that made.

And Spiker, you need to either resize them at build or use CON code to do that. Sizeat X Y or
Code:
eventloadactor YOURACTOR
setactor[THISACTOR].xrepeat X
setactor[THISACTOR].yrepeat y
enda
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Old 07-28-2008, 06:27 AM   #76
Spiker

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
If I resize them manually it won't be accurate. And I don't touch cons, maybe there is some other solution.
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Old 07-28-2008, 06:28 AM   #77
XTHX2

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Well, then if it's possible, TerminX or Hunter_Rus can make a command set which could set the size of the sprite to it's actual value in game... The old build was able to resize monsters to their actual with "." I think.
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Old 07-28-2008, 06:40 AM   #78
Spiker

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
This button works with walls and its not about the size but placement, when it comes to items then it rotates them. While "the reset size" button resets it to it's original wrong size.
Last edited by Spiker; 07-28-2008 at 06:56 AM.
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Old 08-02-2008, 08:23 PM   #79
DissidentRage

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
Have the controls been changed? I know I haven't touched this in about two years, but some of the basic controls either feel wrong or don't work. I can't use -/+ to lighten/darken, it only seems to move the tile number up and down for the item underneath the cursor. Flipping is also extremely selective about when it works.
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Old 08-03-2008, 05:50 AM   #80
XTHX2

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Re: Mapster32 Suggestions
I don't know why it's changed for you, but it absolutely works for me as I've just done some mapping... Perhaps you've changed your configurations?
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