High Resolution Pack discussion thread.

[Spiker]

Originally Posted by PimpUigi

They should really start updating it again.

They could still make it much better.
I'd take it over, but I can't code, and don't have that knowledge, or thirst for that knowledge.
I'd just like to use knowledge I already have.

I suck

And they don't have time. And yes, you suck.

[PimpUigi]

Sweet.
We agree.

That must mean you guys love me.

[Spiker]

Originally Posted by PimpUigi

Sweet.
We agree.

That must mean you guys love me.

I love everyone, seriously Everybody sucks sometimes, that's normal.

[king karl]

2 things i miss about using sd duke (i use dukeplus now mainly for the exploding gore)

i wish enemys wuld bleed the way they did in duke plus when u shoot them instead of the sprite blood drop and i would want ice gore back

[NightFright]

I have stopped using SD_Duke. Loading times decrease without it, and I don't miss the additional effects at all.

[Altered Reality]

2. DukePlus mod. It wasn't included in HRP previously but since it has became a base for many maps it may be considered as a musthave. I think it's up to DeeperThought to decide about this one because he knows whether it can course user confusions, version compatibility issues, etc.

I tried DukePlus a couple of days ago, and it somehow conflicted with the HRP: the bullet holes and the blood appeared as white squares instead of what they were supposed to look like. The only way I found to solve this problem was... not to use DukePlus. I deleted every DukePlus-related file and started using the Eduke32 build from July 09, 2008 again

[Hendricks266]

I did a bit of research, and I found a new MD3 importer plugin for Blender. I saw that it was supposed to be 99% () complete. I attached it.

I tried to import 0603_hangbabe with it and re-export it as an MD3 (with both Plagman's slightly broken MD3 exporter, and the new one included with it), and the animation showed up in the finished product. I don't know about the UV map. I attached the three versions (original, Plagman exp., new exp.) too.

source:
https://svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/...trunk/blender/

[NightFright]

So this means you could use Blender for editing escapist's semi-finished models?

[Hendricks266]

Yes... but not me necessarily. But it will enable us to update the models with lost source (like Hellbound's models), if the UV map importer works. We could also (maybe?) finish the SW ninja model. I'll do more testing at home, to see if that problem is solved.

Parkar, could you please send me the Pig Cop model source? I need for the skin .psd in particular. Hendricks266 [at] gmail [dot] com

[Mr.Fibbles]

hmm. With these developments. . .wait, thats right, I have to write a 15 page term paper, proof read a paper for presentation at a national conference, write a research paper, and keep up with translation work in 2(maybe even 3) languages.
ie, I won't be helping much but I want to.

[Tea Monster]

Importing MD3s into blender has been possible for a while, but it dosen't support animtions. Most of the 'source' files are in 3Ds format, which Blender imports fine.

If you are really stuck, import the md3 into something like Milkshape or Misfit Model 3D and then kick out a format that supports animations. All of these formats support UV Mapping (if it is there to start with).

[Parkar]

Originally Posted by Hunter_rus

As it was announced, a new HRP(not just a HRP_Update!) is scheduled to be released in November but I think there are still some things which aren't clear about it yet.

• What will HRP include? The decision must be done regarding these:
  1. SD_Duke mod. It was included in HRP previously but the mod hasn't been updated for a long time, some its content was moved into HRP and other mods have better effects now so the mod doesn't have as much unique content and effects as it used to.
  2. DukePlus mod. It wasn't included in HRP previously but since it has became a base for many maps it may be considered as a musthave. I think it's up to DeeperThought to decide about this one because he knows whether it can course user confusions, version compatibility issues, etc.
  3. Music Pack. It wasn't included in HRP previously. As far I know it was decided to be a separate pack so users with slow Internet could choose whether they want the Music pack. Note: Music Pack won't work without HRP.
• Even if Music Pack won't be included in HRP, I think it's a good moment to consider some changes. Some people suggested to use higher bitrate for OGGs and replace some tracks. I don't undersand much about those suggestions, I'm just bumping the issues.
• Will HRP have a Windows Installer?
• Will a release candidate be released so everyone could have a look at it before the final version be shipped?

I think the sd-duke mod is more or less obsolete due to Duke Plus and if Deeperthought thinks it's a good idea I would rahter see it distributed along with the HRP than sd duke. Considering it adds additional features for mappers and such I think it's a pertty god fit (i.e. it's more of a map platform than a real mod). As I have mentioned in the Duke Plus thread it's pretty much everything I intended sd duke to be and a bit more.

I don't think there are any other mods that would fit to include with the actual HRP pack. Modders are free to make their own packs with HRP + their own mod if they wish for easier installation though.

Might be some toher commonly used tools that would be useful to keep in the HRP installer. Something to keep in mind is that the release included should probably be fairly stable since not everyone gets all the updates and you (the author) might end up with a lot of feedback on fixed stuff if a version included in the installer has bugs or is just not user friendly enough.

Originally Posted by d3ad connection

I think DukePlus and the HRP should be separate (unless you only mean installing both of them, not integrating them)

Yea, this discussion is only about including mods or other tools with the HRP installer for convenience.

Originally Posted by alandog

I think the mod developers should be involved, since they know well their own creations...

Yea, ofcourse. Especially due to what I wrote above.

Originally Posted by Hendricks266

Yes... but not me necessarily. But it will enable us to update the models with lost source (like Hellbound's models), if the UV map importer works. We could also (maybe?) finish the SW ninja model. I'll do more testing at home, to see if that problem is solved.

Parkar, could you please send me the Pig Cop model source? I need for the skin .psd in particular. Hendricks266 [at] gmail [dot] com

Remind me this weekend if I forget. Out of town on a work assignment so I don't have access to the files at the moment.

[Hendricks266]

Originally Posted by Tea Monster

Importing MD3s into blender has been possible for a while, but it dosen't support animtions. Most of the 'source' files are in 3Ds format, which Blender imports fine.

If you are really stuck, import the md3 into something like Milkshape or Misfit Model 3D and then kick out a format that supports animations. All of these formats support UV Mapping (if it is there to start with).

Right, but this importer supports animation, and it will useful for models with lost source.

[Plagman]

Except importing animation from production models is worthless, except for really tiny touch-ups. No-one wants to modify or add animations without rigging data; some people consider it far easier to just re-rig the model and animate it from scratch.

[Hendricks266]

EDuke32's new HUD shows up as 8-bit. HUD definitions need to be added to certain models, like armor.

[Usurper]

I think everyone should have and use DukePlus.

I think everyone should have and use the HRP.

That said, putting it in the HRP is a bad idea. How frequently is D+ updated? And how frequently is the HRP updated? Does Deeperthought really want a daily rundown of bug reports from people using a three-month old version of his mod?

[Yatta]

Parkar: Here's an additional mirror for the ZIP version of the HRP (v3): www.duke4.org/files/hrp/dn3d_hrp-27-04-2007.zip

[DeeperThought]

Originally Posted by Usurper

I think everyone should have and use DukePlus.

I think everyone should have and use the HRP.

That said, putting it in the HRP is a bad idea. How frequently is D+ updated? And how frequently is the HRP updated? Does Deeperthought really want a daily rundown of bug reports from people using a three-month old version of his mod?

I need to check this thread more often.

Anyway, DP isn't updated as often as it used to be, and I don't think that reports of old bugs will be an issue. I have to deal with that anyway, and I've just gotten used to it.

Duke Plus does have several HRP fixes. Most of these are also in SD_Duke, but some are not. So, for that reason, it does make sense to include Duke Plus. However, I would hope that the average user will understand that Duke Plus is not part of the HRP. The installer should have a separate checkbox for Duke Plus. Some people don't want to use it, and we shouldn't try to jam it down their throats.

If it is decided that Duke Plus will be included, let me know what the deadline is for making any changes to Duke Plus before the installer is made, because I want the included version to be as bug free as possible.

[Hellbound]

I would like to see some effects in Duke Plus, which were in SD_Duke (like transporter star effect, water effects etc etc).

[DeeperThought]

Originally Posted by Hellbound

I would like to see some effects in Duke Plus, which were in SD_Duke (like transporter star effect, water effects etc etc).

Sure, I can do that.

[Hellbound]

Originally Posted by DeeperThought

Sure, I can do that.

That's cool.

[PimpUigi]

Ice Gore?? Brass models?

[DeeperThought]

Originally Posted by Hellbound

That's cool.

OK, I've added a menu option to DP for OpenGL only effects, which will include effects that require models or hi-res (mostly the leftover SD_Duke stuff, but I will also include the pigcop jibs).

So far I have added the water splashes and transporterstar. I like the water circles caused by bullets, but I think it looks weird when the player is running in the water and there is a trail of circles after him.

Hey, I noticed that the blood spawned by newbeasts is red in SD_Duke. Is that a bug, or did I manage to install something wrong?

[Hellbound]

Originally Posted by DeeperThought

Hey, I noticed that the blood spawned by newbeasts is red in SD_Duke. Is that a bug, or did I manage to install something wrong?

Well, strange. It was glowing green for sure.

[PimpUigi]

Pain state skins???

Are they already in DukePlus?
I tried testing and didn't notice them.

But I also didn't delve into it.

[DeeperThought]

Originally Posted by PimpUigi

Pain state skins???

Are they already in DukePlus?
I tried testing and didn't notice them.

Pain skins are already in the HRP, but they only show up when you kill the monsters.

Making them work with Duke Plus in a better way --having the monster continue to use the pain skin once it has been shot-- is a nasty business because I am maintaining 8-bit compatibility. I'm sure it's possible, but it doesn't seem worth the effort.

So far I have added the following:


Shell models
Transporterstar
Water splash and water circles
Models for pigcop jibs (not from SD_Duke)

Is there anything else from SD_Duke that needs to be added? Keeping in mind that there was already a lot of those effects in Duke Plus, or my own versions of them.

[Sobek]

Originally Posted by DeeperThought

Is there anything else from SD_Duke that needs to be added? Keeping in mind that there was already a lot of those effects in Duke Plus, or my own versions of them.

Hmm, I noticed in the release notes at one stage for D+ that you mentioned you'd added the smoke effects from SD_duke. Was this the billowing particle smoke? Because I haven't been able to find that in D+.

Personally, the billowing fire and smoke from SD_duke is something I've always wanted without needing to resort to actually using SD_duke. I did try extracting only the code for those effects, but I never really managed to get anywhere with it. They're such great effects

[DeeperThought]

Originally Posted by Sobek

Hmm, I noticed in the release notes at one stage for D+ that you mentioned you'd added the smoke effects from SD_duke. Was this the billowing particle smoke? Because I haven't been able to find that in D+.

No, I never said that I added the SD_Duke smoke effects. I do use a smoke puff which replaces the standard SMALLSMOKE if the effects option is being used, and bigger ones get spawned from explosions, but that's it.

Originally Posted by Sobek

Personally, the billowing fire and smoke from SD_duke is something I've always wanted without needing to resort to actually using SD_duke. I did try extracting only the code for those effects, but I never really managed to get anywhere with it. They're such great effects

I worry about performance, especially with all the other code that is running in Duke Plus for things other than graphical effects. I'll look into it, though.

[PimpUigi]

Originally Posted by DeeperThought

Making them work with Duke Plus in a better way --having the monster continue to use the pain skin once it has been shot-- is a nasty business because I am maintaining 8-bit compatibility. I'm sure it's possible, but it doesn't seem worth the effort.

That's a shame : (

Originally Posted by DeeperThought

Is there anything else from SD_Duke that needs to be added? Keeping in mind that there was already a lot of those effects in Duke Plus, or my own versions of them.

Ice jibs?

I hate the SD_Duke smoke and fire TBH.
Wish I could turn those two things off.

[Sobek]

Originally Posted by DeeperThought

No, I never said that I added the SD_Duke smoke effects. I do use a smoke puff which replaces the standard SMALLSMOKE if the effects option is being used, and bigger ones get spawned from explosions, but that's it.

I misread, all good.

Originally Posted by DeeperThought

I worry about performance, especially with all the other code that is running in Duke Plus for things other than graphical effects. I'll look into it, though.

Thanks for looking into it, it's appreciated. I can't imagine that simple fire or smoke effect being more hurtfull to performance than, say, a heap of gust spawner sprites? Even on my ancient old PC's, SD_duke's fire and smoke effects create a neglidgable performance impact even with 5+ effects in the one area (perhaps a player radius could determine their visibility for performances' sake?). Anyway, I understand that with everything else D+ is doing it could be an issue, but I'm cautiously optimistic.

I hate the SD_Duke smoke and fire TBH.
Wish I could turn those two things off.

I'm simply suggesting them as an additional effect, as opposed to overwriting the current smoke and fire

[DeeperThought]

Originally Posted by Sobek

I can't imagine that simple fire or smoke effect being more hurtfull to performance than, say, a heap of gust spawner sprites?

Yes, but the smoke gusts only exist in maps that were made for Duke Plus and only in places where the mapper intended to put them. On the other hand, when you start adding effects to an old sprite, you risk drastically bringing down the performance of old maps where is wasn't an issue before. A fiery room now becomes a fiery smoke filled room with tons of sprites being spawned.

[Sobek]

Originally Posted by DeeperThought

Yes, but the smoke gusts only exist in maps that were made for Duke Plus and only in places where the mapper intended to put them. On the other hand, when you start adding effects to an old sprite, you risk drastically bringing down the performance of old maps where is wasn't an issue before. A fiery room now becomes a fiery smoke filled room with tons of sprites being spawned.

I see... Though in my last post I mentioned my thoughts on this being a seperate effect. I certainly wouldn't want to overwrite the existing smoke and fire effects, not at all. Is it signifnicantly more difficult to alter the code so as not to replace the stock effects?

[Hendricks266]

Originally Posted by Parkar

Remind me this weekend if I forget. Out of town on a work assignment so I don't have access to the files at the moment.

Could you please give me the Pig Cop and Duke source?

[NightFright]

Since the full HRP will take longer than expected, I have compiled another HRP Update Pack. Download v3.11 together with new maphacks from my site. Even more interesting should be the new XXX Pack, which finally grew into a full release thanks to chicken.

[Parkar]

Originally Posted by Hendricks266

Could you please give me the Pig Cop and Duke source?

Ohh, right. Digging them up right now.

Edit:

Duke (max, 3ds, ase, obj / psd + wire png)
http://www.duke4.org/files/hrp/source/duke.zip

Pig Cop (3ds, ase, obj / wire png)
http://www.duke4.org/files/hrp/source/pigcop.zip

I don't have any photo shop / gimp files with layers for the Pig Cop but if there is anything else you want like other 3d model formats etc let me know.

[PimpUigi]

NightFright, you wouldn't happen to have the april version of the xxx pack around?

Oh yea, and it looks like the defs for the shotgun are not the ones I supplied with my shotgun changes.

[NightFright]

XXX Pack v1.11 is still available at old edgefiles address, haven't deleted it yet.
http://www.edgefiles.com/files/22217.html

As for the shotgun defs. Must have slipped my attention. Sorry. Will be corrected.

[PimpUigi]

Thanks for the link man : )

XXX pack is now too naughty for me and my family image.
lol

[NightFright]

Yeah, I understand. Maybe I will make another version which takes nudity down a notch, i.e. showing only boobies or so. chicken really delivered in that aspect, maybe even more than what was actually needed.

[PimpUigi]

He's a beast.

I really like the movie theater textures.
I wish he did a clean version of the same thing pretty much.

Though nothing really replaces the original of that very well : (