Shadow Warrior Re-texturing Project

[hitman71]

ok, thats what i thought... And thats fine. I've been grabbing them as they appear so far and can continue to do that.

My next question

Duke was ported yonks ago (years?). How come people are still doing textures for that ? If its such a slow task to make it complete are we gonna be waiting months and months for a SW HRP ?

Anyway, good stuff so far. Will keep my eyes peeled.

[Eric R.]

here is a little pic (244) for you, can we use a model instead of a sprite?

http://ericrevollo.freewebsitehosting.com/244.png
opy and paste the link or it will not work

[DLT]

hitman71 said:
ok, thats what i thought... And thats fine. I've been grabbing them as they appear so far and can continue to do that.

My next question

Duke was ported yonks ago (years?). How come people are still doing textures for that ? If its such a slow task to make it complete are we gonna be waiting months and months for a SW HRP ?

Anyway, good stuff so far. Will keep my eyes peeled.

I think the SW stuff will pick up when the duke stuff is done. As for the duke textures duke has over 4000(not sure how many are sprite frames though) of them so you can see why it's taking so long.

[hitman71]

I understand its a big project, but the win32 port of Duke has been out for ages. Seems odd that its not done yet especially with so many fans and so many working on it. Aren't there people who are fans of SW more than Duke and will invest more time in one or the other... I kinda hoped at least a couple of people would jump into the SW stuff and start churning it out. Initial release rate just seems a little poor IMO. Quality is great though I've added some level 1 textures already and it really spices the game up.

[Roma Loom]

Source code for Duke3D was released ~2 years ago. jfDuke was born a year ago. The retexturing thread was started 15/01/04.

[Ecmaster76]

SW work will pick up when a better version of JFSW is out. I really appreciate JonoF's hard work in getting it out five minutes before the source was released, but unfortunately it needs work. Its kind of discouraging not having working saves, ingame level loading, and the build bugs.

[djimd]

Y - I understand it takes him a bit of time buiding the binaries after each update - otherwise I'm sure he would have got the Savegame fix out sooner - I guess this is probably the most wanted feature to make the game playable.

[TerminX]

Ecmaster76 said:
SW work will pick up when a better version of JFSW is out. I really appreciate JonoF's hard work in getting it out five minutes before the source was released, but unfortunately it needs work. Its kind of discouraging not having working saves, ingame level loading, and the build bugs.

Would you prefer there be no JFSW at all? I don't really understand how you can complain about the quality of the current build and complain that a new build isn't out yet in the same post. That said, savegame support has been complete for some time, and a beta build with it working was even released to those on IRC who were around at the time the link was posted. A new build will be publically available sometime in the near future.

Until then, I would suggest you stop complaining about what others spend their personal time on when they could be doing something that actually makes them money.

[djimd]

TerminX said:

Would you prefer there be no JFSW at all? I don't really understand how you can complain about the quality of the current build and complain that a new build isn't out yet in the same post. That said, savegame support has been complete for some time, and a beta build with it working was even released to those on IRC who were around at the time the link was posted. A new build will be publically available sometime in the near future.

Until then, I would suggest you stop complaining about what others spend their personal time on when they could be doing something that actually makes them money.

I agree Jonof does it all for nothing and does a great job of it too - BTW Terminx is there any chance of getting a copy ( PM or email) of the Beta with savegames working? Thx

[GodBlitZor]

You just had you ass handed by TerminX

Hes right though. Ive been waiting patiently....

[Ecmaster76]

Read the post.

Ecmaster76 said:
I really appreciate JonoF's hard work in getting it out five minutes before the source was released,

My further comments were just to explain why I don't think much high res or modeling has been done.

I did not say JonoF was being too slow, I said it needed work. Just like JFDuke still needs work, even though it is already excellent.

I did not say it sucked, I said it was discouraging. At the moment it lacks some of the functionality of the original version. This makes it difficult to test stuff out and enjoy it general.

You don't have to be harsh all the time TerminX.

[TerminX]

Ecmaster76 said:
You don't have to be harsh all the time TerminX.

I still maintain that you have never seen "harsh."

[GodBlitZor]

I agree, I dont wanna see TerminX pissed off.

[Dr. Kill]

just read his avatar!

[Steve]

Ecmaster76 said:
SW work will pick up when a better version of JFSW is out. I really appreciate JonoF's hard work in getting it out five minutes before the source was released, but unfortunately it needs work. Its kind of discouraging not having working saves, ingame level loading, and the build bugs.

He's doing both the Duke3d port and the SW port. Of course things will be moving slowly.

[Piterplus]

Dr. Kill said:
just read his avatar!

(offtopic)
That slogan on avatar belongs to John Romero...right before release of Daikatana.
After release everybody has has poor Jonny as his bitch

[Dr. Kill]

would've never known that

[Kristian Joensen]

piterplus said:

(offtopic)
That slogan on avatar belongs to John Romero...right before release of Daikatana.
After release everybody has has poor Jonny as his bitch

Actually he said that back when Daikatana was annouced, he promised a release in 7 months and he had an add wich said" John Romero is about to make everyone his bitch".

[Eric R.]

i think the image wasn't displayed so here is it
/http://ericrevollo.freewebsitehosting.com/244.png

[hitman71]

Looks cool. You asked if it was ok to use 3D models for textures, well i don't see any reason not to apart from 1. Shadows may look out of place in a specifically lit area. Torches on walls, overhead lights etc. What do others think ?

[Ecmaster76]

If there were shadows on the original than its cool. Some shadowing is needed anyhow just to give a sense of depth, since sprites are all flat.

[hitman71]

absolutely, but i meant if there was a light on the left and the shadow was from the top it might look odd. Then again maybe it wouldn't even be noticed ??

[TerminX]

hitman71 said:
if there was a light on the left and the shadow was from the top

This is Shadow Warrior, not Half-Life 2.

[GodBlitZor]

^exactly.

[hitman71]

Simply stating fact Don't pick on me, i'm new - boohoo !!

Another thing that could cause this to be a bad idea (shadows not models) is that 2 diff people make 2 new textures that sit next to each other ingame. Both use models and both shadow them at diff angles. That would definately look odd !!

discuss lol

[Tea Monster]

Is it possible in JFSW to have any wall texture as a model?

In Duke we ran into problems where certain things that could benefit from being models were actually treated as wall textures rather than sprites. It is possible to makes sprites into models but not wall textures.

Maybe JFSW works differently (or maybe not).

Just think if every texture was a model... now think of how much you would have to spend on a graphics card to render it all.

If you really want to do that sort of thing, rip off some code from one of the Quake I ports and get some bump-mapping in there.

[hitman71]

hehe - correct me if i'm wrong, but i think its just a texture made from a model, not a texture remade AS a model. Using a model adds realism and depth to the final texture. Like shadows. In the end its still a flat image. Correct ?

[Tea Monster]

hitman71 said:
hehe - correct me if i'm wrong, but i think its just a texture made from a model, not a texture remade AS a model. Using a model adds realism and depth to the final texture. Like shadows. In the end its still a flat image. Correct ?

Yeah, thats VERY different!

They did a lot of that in Duke. I am not so sure on SW as it looked a lot more "painterly" than Duke. Supposedly most of the monsters in Duke 3D were 3D modelled, rendered and posed - then screen-grabs of those models were used for all the in game 'sprites'.

This was all pre-Quake. If you do it correctly (right number of animation frames and image resolution) it looks just like the "real" thing.

[Ecmaster76]

298

[Ecmaster76]

5055

[Ecmaster76]

5056

[Ecmaster76]

5057

[hitman71]

nice

[tpz]

these look very nice.

Good work!

[hitman71]

SW HRP Addon

Everything so far, apart from 1 switch which uses an md2 file. Will add it in next zip when more textures are ready.

I've got the latest version of grp viewer and have started ripping textures to remake some myself too. Just to have a go really

[Another Duke Fan]

Cool!! Keep it up to date mate!

[Geoffrey]

Cool! A HRP! Saves me from browsing through !4! ( YES 4!!! ) pages!

Side notes:
- it's probably a better idea to use the same directory system Parkar uses for the Duke HRP
- it's probably a good idea to let Parkar do this alltogether?

[hitman71]

I'm not here to step on toes. If someone else sets up a site and starts to package this properly then great, i will then just concentrate on textures. For now, i just collected whats in this thread, did a little file conversion (some were jpgs) and added all the defines into 1 file so it all works. Simply for newcomers so they can grab it all in one go. I know theres not a massive amount, and only 4 pages, but it does take a fair while to find them all and get all the defines together.

I do however have some questions.

1. Does
definetexture 0000 0 0 0 -1 -1 highres/textures/0000.png
work the same as
definetexture 000 0 0 0 -1 -1 highres/textures/0000.png
(1 less 0) This is simply to make the formatting easier in the textures.def file. btw, i ordered them.

2. Can the defs for the lightswitch go into the same textures.def file ? Baring in mind theres an md2 file included which will need to go in a "models" folder.

definemodel "models/es_0712.md2" 1.1 0
definemodelframe "off" 551 551
definemodelframe "on" 552 552

3. The numerics and letters packs are doubled up. In the defs file they are listed as...
definetexture 2930 0 0 0 -1 -1 highres/textures/2930.png
and
definetexture 2930 17 0 0 -1 -1 highres/textures/2930_17.png
Can someone explain to me why ? Apart from a diff colour are they needed ? does the 17 mean a displacement ?

4. What file formats can textures be in ? PNG can be quite a lot bigger than JPG in some cases. Does GIF work too ?

5. If a new texture is not to scale with the original, is it resized automatically for use ingame. I realise most are 1-2 or 1-3, but there was 1 that was completely different (the crack one).

Thanks for your time.

[Ecmaster76]

1. It should work the same, but I think you should avoid numbering tiles 0x, where x is any number of one or more digits. I think the parser considers stuff like 01234 to be a hex value, where 1234 would be base ten (normal).

2. I don't know since I don't screw with models

3. '17' is the palette value for the texture. SW uses palettized textures that only have a certain amount of colors. Changing the value rearranges the color order so that the texture looks different (think the different versions of the keys or whatever). However a 32bit OpenGL texture is not palettized. So the preexisting textures are palette shifted before being sent to the rendered (I think). But this won't work with the hightile stuff. So the best solution is just to make a different version of the texture that follows the coloring of the original at a different pallete value.

So say the original texture is blue with palette=0. Palette=17 is a red version or whatever, so I make a red version and change that first number in the definition to '17'. So anytime it comes across that texture with a palette=17 it loads the alternate version. Otherwise it loads the original unless other palette values are defined.

4. Don't use GIF. Ever. PNG or non-progressive JPEG is fine. If the PNG is too big, try saving it as an 8bit PNG with 256 colors. If thats still too big try lower numbers of colors. In effect you keep detail by losing colors. JPEG is better if you are willing to sacrifice detail but maintain color content.

Of course thats color vs detail at the same resolution. You can also drop resolution, but that kinda sucks.

[Parkar]

Geoffrey said:
Cool! A HRP! Saves me from browsing through !4! ( YES 4!!! ) pages!

Side notes:
- it's probably a better idea to use the same directory system Parkar uses for the Duke HRP
- it's probably a good idea to let Parkar do this alltogether?

Some notes:
- I am workig on a sw HRP.
- It's a long time until its even close to a first release.
- It's probably a good idea fo others to put out collections so people don't have to wait until my HRP is released or download every texture.