DNF and all that "badass" stuff?

Addicted Gamer · 05-17-2006, 03:30 PM

first of all - my english isn't good, so try to understand me what i mean.

the thing is that i am worried about upcoming Duke's linear gameplay. what i mean by that is that DNF may come as linear as DN3D was. no, i don't mean that DN3D sucked or something; instead it rocks a lot! but times have changed and nowadays _kickass_ fps should feature an agitation.

because i have read the forums sometimes, and as i can see, some people are saying something like: "Duke should kickass" etc -- i'm not saying it's wrong, but just time, gaming technology, and all of it have made a big jump since 1996.

so, i would like to see some more than a "superhero" action..

also, Duke's not a Serious Sam -- last one has little bit too utopic environment and such fantasy.

well then - enjoyable but also action-full story is most important.. (but remember, just a childish kind of running and killing is not what nowadays world needs

)

Dopefish7590 · 05-17-2006, 03:36 PM

makes me wonder too, will it be linear or not

Micki! · 05-17-2006, 03:39 PM

It has been stated before that the gameplay will be linear...

But, what makes linear games good, is the gameplay, and the levels... And since i believe both of these will be great, i'm not doubting it'll be great whatsoever...

Tang Lung · 05-17-2006, 03:40 PM

It better do something other than simply boil down to run, shoot, jump, repeat, If it's wants anyone to say it's been worth the wait.

SyntaxN · 05-17-2006, 04:20 PM

I don´t like "totally" linear games at all anymore, I think more than one way to reach a point is not a bad thing.

Arc-Demon · 05-17-2006, 04:40 PM

Gentlemen...let us not forget Multiplayer. Even if DNF's single player is linear, if the weapons are cool, then multiplayer will be badass

.

Commando Nukem · 05-17-2006, 08:22 PM

I'd hardly say Duke 3D was linear either. There are definatly multiple paths to the exits of the levels. For instance in Hollywood Holocaust.

You go down the vent to the road. You can go straight, take a left go into the projector room, blow open the theatre screen, jump out the window and up to the exit. Or you can go right from the vent, get the RPG, blast your way inside, go blow open the theatre and repeat the previous way. Or you can go the long way around through the arcade.

There are plenty of places like that throughout the game. =D

ReadOnly · 05-18-2006, 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Addicted Gamer

the thing is that i am worried about upcoming Duke's linear gameplay. what i mean by that is that DNF may come as linear as DN3D was. no, i don't mean that DN3D sucked or something; instead it rocks a lot! but times have changed and nowadays _kickass_ fps should feature an agitation.

What? Are FPS nowadays really mostly non-linear?

Addicted Gamer · 05-18-2006, 05:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ReadOnly

What? Are FPS nowadays really mostly non-linear?

no, many of them indeed are.
but, honestly, we are talking about game what we've waited since 1997!

and this game just gotta be something more than a normal nowadays shooter, right? in other words, it should be something revolutionary (maybe i'm overreacting, but that time just deserves it).

edit: also, i pointed out that nowadays fps _should_ feature an agitation, not just run and blow up everything - so, i meant there aren't indeed any good non-linear fps's out there.
Duke is the right guy for all that action and stuff, but still, DNF needs to be something more.

Commando Nukem · 05-18-2006, 06:33 AM

What more is there then blowing sh*t up while looking really cool, babes, large quantities of badguys and explosives, super cool enviroments, vehicles, one liners, babes, all kinds of guns, funny in-jokes..... Need I go on? Duke has got his bases covered. His badass stuff is what sets him apart from DOOM and HALFLIFE.

Which mind you are games that just recently *tried* to be *more* then what they were. They ended up just being good because of it. Sure HL2 had a lot of great moments, as did Doom3. but really, they both had a lot of moments of repitition. The only times I felt that way during Duke 3D was when someone interupted me while I was playing. Then my mood wasnt totally wired up in the game.

btw its 5AM here and im going to bed... oiii why do I keep staying up so late...

Jezza · 05-18-2006, 11:53 AM

I do beleive that George has said the story will be linear, the gameplay will be linear, but a little freeform..

I think he said something about the best kind of linear gameplay being the sort that makes you think it's totally freeform, and DNF is gonna be like that.

But I might be wrong...

DavoX · 05-18-2006, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jezza

I do beleive that George has said the story will be linear, the gameplay will be linear, but a little freeform..

I think he said something about the best kind of linear gameplay being the sort that makes you think it's totally freeform, and DNF is gonna be like that.

But I might be wrong...

FarCry was linear but still made you believe you had total freedom, i liked it.

Commando Nukem · 05-18-2006, 02:49 PM

Yeah, put someone in a big ass city map with places to go, and all kinds of activity, but its all gonna lead to the shiney nuke button anyway

dosboot · 05-18-2006, 05:16 PM

I hope DNF doesn't go the way of modern FPS's and make each level seamlessly flow into the next.

Commando Nukem · 05-18-2006, 07:00 PM

Then prepare to be dissappointed, I believe they have said time and again that it will flow. Though im not sure... I swear I remember reading stats screens were in? Corrected me if im wrong someone...

Zaarin · 05-18-2006, 07:06 PM

Freedom is an illusion even in every day life, so linear is fine by me as long as the story or gimmicks keeps me intrested and I feel confident about that DNF will have both.

Commando Nukem · 05-18-2006, 08:35 PM

I think Raschzak from SST said it best. The only real freedom anyone has is figuring things out for yourself. So I agree in that respect, and its holds true in games. Using a guide kinda takes away from the gameplay experience (theres no reward to playing anymore, someone else solved the problem for you. Lol)

dosboot · 05-20-2006, 02:25 AM

Well if there are still stat screens then DNF is the way I was hoping. Basically what I was trying to say was I hope DNF is not like Half-Life where you walk down a hallway, are suprised with a "loading..." message, and then suddenly you are in the next level. Many DN3D levels were "seamless" in the sense that they flowed into each other in a logical way (like Red Light District >> Death Row >> Toxic Dump), but the stat screen and nuke button was always there separating them which is very important I think.

I'm not sure exactly how to explain it. But the Half-Life way of making levels "seamless" encourages backtracking, perfectionism, and reloading everytime you die. If you died in DN3D it was never because you didn't forage for enough ammo or backtrack for enough medkits, you died because the aliens beat you. The level breaks also made an easy way to keep yourself honest with regards to saving. Saving at the start of a level feels acceptable enough to not feel like you are cheating, and if you are a real badass you would just start the level over with your pistol. That is something else too. It was a whole new experience to start a level with just your pistol. Every level gave you enough weapons if you were willing to look for them.

trackit · 05-20-2006, 05:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DavoX

FarCry was linear but still made you believe you had total freedom, i liked it.

yeah you belived it to the point where you tried to get on the other side of the island on the boat and got instantly killed by helicopters

But i agree that far cry made really good job in creating the feeling of non-linearity, thumbs up.

And yes, George said that DNF will be linear, but i think its just the way it is... cause its really really hard to make an FPS nonlinear. You just think that ohh, it will be so cool if game will be nonlinear. But if you start to play such game you will get frustrated very quickly, cause you just get lost, dont know what to do, where you are supposed to go etc etc... and then quit the game. its really hard to make fps nonlinear and at the same time keep player focused and entertained so he dont get bored... IMHO

I think the best we can do right now is linear gampley with couple of alternate paths here and there in levels, and also create some illusion of nonlinearity...

helious · 05-20-2006, 05:23 AM

Lockdown!

we already have a big thread about this!

http://forums.3drealms.com/vb/showthread.php?t=15954

Commando Nukem · 05-20-2006, 05:44 AM

Yeah, that one is just slightly dead :P

Malgon · 05-22-2006, 06:00 AM

Masking the game to appear to be non-linear is the key I think. I believe interactivity can make the world feel more alive, and add to the sense that you aren't just following a direct path through a `level' but are flowing through a real world setting. Non-linearity doesn't really exist in games as it is impossible for a developer to account for every possibility that could happen. I like to think of games as linear and multi-linear, as it makes the most sense that way.

Tang Lung · 05-22-2006, 01:05 PM

Also 3DR, make sure at some point Duke is topless and running around with a massive machine gun. I would enjoy that greatly..

DavoX · 05-23-2006, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tang Lung

Also 3DR, make sure at some point Duke is topless and running around with a massive machine gun. I would enjoy that greatly..

Are you coming out of the closet?

hell-angel · 05-24-2006, 01:41 AM

owned.

DavoX · 05-24-2006, 01:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hell-angel

owned.

Making use of the first quote in your sig hell-angel

hell-angel · 05-24-2006, 04:37 AM

That's what it's for

You are free to use it (it's not mine anyway) as long as you don't use it against me.

Tang Lung · 05-26-2006, 05:05 AM

No, im not coming out of the closet.

There's nothing gay about wanting to see a hot, semi naked man running gracefully through a field with a huge metal machine gun gripped tightly in his large, manly fists. Nothing gay atall.

Also 3DR, I think you should remove the female strippers, as they don't really bring anything to the game, and instead put in several male sidekicks for Duke. It will be very humid, so I don't think they should be wearing tops (maybe bowties to keep their necks warm).

trackit · 05-26-2006, 05:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tang Lung

No, im not coming out of the closet.

There's nothing gay about wanting to see a hot, semi naked man running gracefully through a field with a huge metal machine gun gripped tightly in his large, manly fists. Nothing gay atall.

Also 3DR, I think you should remove the female strippers, as they don't really bring anything to the game, and instead put in several male sidekicks for Duke. It will be very humid, so I don't think they should be wearing tops (maybe bowties to keep their necks warm).

Well, maybe you should come out of the closet

DavoX · 05-26-2006, 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trackit

Well, maybe you should come out of the closet

Maybe he was already out of the closet before

On topic: Duke will have all the "badass" stuff, there's no doubt about that.

Tang Lung · 05-26-2006, 07:54 AM

Well quite frankly im shocked that a game like Duke Nukem would attract such homophobes!

Anyway, the key word in Badass is 'ass', and therefore, Duke's jeans should be made tighter than ever before.

DudeNukem · 05-26-2006, 08:36 AM

God, please stop!

Falcon · 05-26-2006, 05:28 PM

Gay Mod for DNF... something we could expect when it comes out

.
Personally, I'd prefer the classic one with the strippers.
Ah, Tang, if it was ironic, it is one of the best ones I've read on this subject.
Falcon

Commando Nukem · 05-26-2006, 06:36 PM

To Quote Duke Nukem himself on the subject.

"Not in this life time!"

oak man · 05-26-2006, 08:48 PM

heh heh! This thread is hella funny!

qwerty · 05-27-2006, 02:09 AM

Duke 3d was linear ?

almost every level had different routes to choose from where you want to go first

I hope it will be like that in DNF too or I will be really dissapointed

Commando Nukem · 05-27-2006, 03:37 AM

exactly, a lot of levels had two ways to get to the exit or onto the path to the exit. Now the only way to make the game more non-linear would be to have multiple exits/level routes that interwove. WHich is VERY hard to pull off, and to my knowledge only Half-life and Quake2 did it well.

The Count · 05-27-2006, 05:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tang Lung

Well quite frankly im shocked that a game like Duke Nukem would attract such homophobes!

Anyway, the key word in Badass is 'ass', and therefore, Duke's jeans should be made tighter than ever before.

Hehe. Just let Duke swim for a while and when he emerges from the water his drying jeans absolutely will fit even tighter...

Tang Lung · 05-27-2006, 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Count

Hehe. Just let Duke swim for a while and when he emerges from the water his drying jeans absolutely will fit even tighter...

Hey, you just reminded me of something I forgot to add! realisticaly simulated SWEAT!

trackit · 05-27-2006, 01:50 PM

George said that DNF has full body awareness... So theres a chance you might see Dukes boner, when stripper shakes those boobs

05-17-2006, 03:30 PM	#1
Addicted Gamer	DNF and all that "badass" stuff? first of all - my english isn't good, so try to understand me what i mean. the thing is that i am worried about upcoming Duke's linear gameplay. what i mean by that is that DNF may come as linear as DN3D was. no, i don't mean that DN3D sucked or something; instead it rocks a lot! but times have changed and nowadays _kickass_ fps should feature an agitation. because i have read the forums sometimes, and as i can see, some people are saying something like: "Duke should kickass" etc -- i'm not saying it's wrong, but just time, gaming technology, and all of it have made a big jump since 1996. so, i would like to see some more than a "superhero" action.. also, Duke's not a Serious Sam -- last one has little bit too utopic environment and such fantasy. well then - enjoyable but also action-full story is most important.. (but remember, just a childish kind of running and killing is not what nowadays world needs )

05-17-2006, 03:36 PM	#2
Dopefish7590	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? makes me wonder too, will it be linear or not

05-17-2006, 03:39 PM	#3
Micki!	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? It has been stated before that the gameplay will be linear... But, what makes linear games good, is the gameplay, and the levels... And since i believe both of these will be great, i'm not doubting it'll be great whatsoever... __________________ A true genius does not need boundaries such as 'common sense'

05-17-2006, 03:40 PM	#4
Tang Lung	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? It better do something other than simply boil down to run, shoot, jump, repeat, If it's wants anyone to say it's been worth the wait. __________________ "I'd like to begin by saying **** Lance Armstrong" MOON PRINCESS POWER!

05-17-2006, 04:20 PM	#5
SyntaxN	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? I don´t like "totally" linear games at all anymore, I think more than one way to reach a point is not a bad thing.

05-17-2006, 04:40 PM	#6
Arc-Demon	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? Gentlemen...let us not forget Multiplayer. Even if DNF's single player is linear, if the weapons are cool, then multiplayer will be badass .

05-17-2006, 08:22 PM	#7
Commando Nukem	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? I'd hardly say Duke 3D was linear either. There are definatly multiple paths to the exits of the levels. For instance in Hollywood Holocaust. You go down the vent to the road. You can go straight, take a left go into the projector room, blow open the theatre screen, jump out the window and up to the exit. Or you can go right from the vent, get the RPG, blast your way inside, go blow open the theatre and repeat the previous way. Or you can go the long way around through the arcade. There are plenty of places like that throughout the game. =D __________________ Open Maw Productions

05-18-2006, 06:33 AM	#10
Commando Nukem	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? What more is there then blowing sht up while looking really cool, babes, large quantities of badguys and explosives, super cool enviroments, vehicles, one liners, babes, all kinds of guns, funny in-jokes..... Need I go on? Duke has got his bases covered. His badass stuff is what sets him apart from DOOM and HALFLIFE. Which mind you are games that just recently tried* to be more then what they were. They ended up just being good because of it. Sure HL2 had a lot of great moments, as did Doom3. but really, they both had a lot of moments of repitition. The only times I felt that way during Duke 3D was when someone interupted me while I was playing. Then my mood wasnt totally wired up in the game. btw its 5AM here and im going to bed... oiii why do I keep staying up so late... __________________ Open Maw Productions

05-18-2006, 11:53 AM	#11
Jezza	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? I do beleive that George has said the story will be linear, the gameplay will be linear, but a little freeform.. I think he said something about the best kind of linear gameplay being the sort that makes you think it's totally freeform, and DNF is gonna be like that. But I might be wrong... __________________ God gave man imagination to compensate him for what he is not; and a sense of humor to console him for what he is.

05-18-2006, 02:49 PM	#13
Commando Nukem	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? Yeah, put someone in a big ass city map with places to go, and all kinds of activity, but its all gonna lead to the shiney nuke button anyway __________________ Open Maw Productions

05-18-2006, 05:16 PM	#14
dosboot	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? I hope DNF doesn't go the way of modern FPS's and make each level seamlessly flow into the next.

05-18-2006, 07:00 PM	#15
Commando Nukem	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? Then prepare to be dissappointed, I believe they have said time and again that it will flow. Though im not sure... I swear I remember reading stats screens were in? Corrected me if im wrong someone... __________________ Open Maw Productions

05-18-2006, 07:06 PM	#16
Zaarin	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? Freedom is an illusion even in every day life, so linear is fine by me as long as the story or gimmicks keeps me intrested and I feel confident about that DNF will have both. __________________ "Remember kids, if it's fun there's a good chance it's illegal!"

05-18-2006, 08:35 PM	#17
Commando Nukem	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? I think Raschzak from SST said it best. The only real freedom anyone has is figuring things out for yourself. So I agree in that respect, and its holds true in games. Using a guide kinda takes away from the gameplay experience (theres no reward to playing anymore, someone else solved the problem for you. Lol) __________________ Open Maw Productions

05-20-2006, 02:25 AM	#18
dosboot	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? Well if there are still stat screens then DNF is the way I was hoping. Basically what I was trying to say was I hope DNF is not like Half-Life where you walk down a hallway, are suprised with a "loading..." message, and then suddenly you are in the next level. Many DN3D levels were "seamless" in the sense that they flowed into each other in a logical way (like Red Light District >> Death Row >> Toxic Dump), but the stat screen and nuke button was always there separating them which is very important I think. I'm not sure exactly how to explain it. But the Half-Life way of making levels "seamless" encourages backtracking, perfectionism, and reloading everytime you die. If you died in DN3D it was never because you didn't forage for enough ammo or backtrack for enough medkits, you died because the aliens beat you. The level breaks also made an easy way to keep yourself honest with regards to saving. Saving at the start of a level feels acceptable enough to not feel like you are cheating, and if you are a real badass you would just start the level over with your pistol. That is something else too. It was a whole new experience to start a level with just your pistol. Every level gave you enough weapons if you were willing to look for them. Last edited by dosboot; 05-20-2006 at 02:35 AM.

05-20-2006, 05:23 AM	#20
helious	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? Lockdown! we already have a big thread about this! http://forums.3drealms.com/vb/showthread.php?t=15954

05-20-2006, 05:44 AM	#21
Commando Nukem	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? Yeah, that one is just slightly dead :P __________________ Open Maw Productions

05-22-2006, 06:00 AM	#22
Malgon	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? Masking the game to appear to be non-linear is the key I think. I believe interactivity can make the world feel more alive, and add to the sense that you aren't just following a direct path through a `level' but are flowing through a real world setting. Non-linearity doesn't really exist in games as it is impossible for a developer to account for every possibility that could happen. I like to think of games as linear and multi-linear, as it makes the most sense that way. __________________ -Most wanted games: Doom 4, Tomb Raider, Beyond Good and Evil 2

05-22-2006, 01:05 PM	#23
Tang Lung	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? Also 3DR, make sure at some point Duke is topless and running around with a massive machine gun. I would enjoy that greatly.. __________________ "I'd like to begin by saying **** Lance Armstrong" MOON PRINCESS POWER!

05-24-2006, 01:41 AM	#25
hell-angel	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? owned.

05-24-2006, 04:37 AM	#27
hell-angel	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? That's what it's for You are free to use it (it's not mine anyway) as long as you don't use it against me.

05-26-2006, 05:05 AM	#28
Tang Lung	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? No, im not coming out of the closet. There's nothing gay about wanting to see a hot, semi naked man running gracefully through a field with a huge metal machine gun gripped tightly in his large, manly fists. Nothing gay atall. Also 3DR, I think you should remove the female strippers, as they don't really bring anything to the game, and instead put in several male sidekicks for Duke. It will be very humid, so I don't think they should be wearing tops (maybe bowties to keep their necks warm). __________________ "I'd like to begin by saying **** Lance Armstrong" MOON PRINCESS POWER!

05-26-2006, 07:54 AM	#31
Tang Lung	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? Well quite frankly im shocked that a game like Duke Nukem would attract such homophobes! Anyway, the key word in Badass is 'ass', and therefore, Duke's jeans should be made tighter than ever before. __________________ "I'd like to begin by saying **** Lance Armstrong" MOON PRINCESS POWER!

05-26-2006, 08:36 AM	#32
DudeNukem	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? God, please stop!

05-26-2006, 05:28 PM	#33
Falcon	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? Gay Mod for DNF... something we could expect when it comes out . Personally, I'd prefer the classic one with the strippers. Ah, Tang, if it was ironic, it is one of the best ones I've read on this subject. Falcon

05-26-2006, 06:36 PM	#34
Commando Nukem	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? To Quote Duke Nukem himself on the subject. "Not in this life time!" __________________ Open Maw Productions

05-26-2006, 08:48 PM	#35
oak man	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? heh heh! This thread is hella funny! __________________ "I hereby nominate 'DUDE!! Huge bag of cheetos!' for 'Best Topic Title of the Year, 2006.'"-ZzTX "I vote oak man for supreme leader of the 3DR boards."-Tang Lung >>My flickr page<<

05-27-2006, 02:09 AM	#36
qwerty	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? Duke 3d was linear ? almost every level had different routes to choose from where you want to go first I hope it will be like that in DNF too or I will be really dissapointed

05-27-2006, 03:37 AM	#37
Commando Nukem	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? exactly, a lot of levels had two ways to get to the exit or onto the path to the exit. Now the only way to make the game more non-linear would be to have multiple exits/level routes that interwove. WHich is VERY hard to pull off, and to my knowledge only Half-life and Quake2 did it well. __________________ Open Maw Productions

05-27-2006, 01:50 PM	#40
trackit	Re: DNF and all that "badass" stuff? George said that DNF has full body awareness... So theres a chance you might see Dukes boner, when stripper shakes those boobs __________________ Sorry, but you're reading into it too much!