One question, and on comment.

1031982 · 09-01-2008, 10:54 PM

Ok, I think it's EXELENT this is coming to XBLA. I got points on my account, and am going to buy as soon as I can.
That being said, I have seen the vids and pics of it in progress; and I am wondering if later on, th4e dev team will add DLC for updated graphics? By all means, I understand the reason for keeping it how it was, as I said I am buying it right away. But having the option to have updated graphics would be nice. I would like to point out that Luminous has an add on pack at 213MB. Also, with every pack released, and minimal save files, it takes up 886MB. Quite a large game for Arcade with everything, and yet most of it is optional.

Sharpie · 09-01-2008, 11:36 PM

IMO there is NO way DN3D XBLA will ever see an update that gives it updated graphics. If 3DR had any intentions to have the game with enhanced visuals they would of already incorporated them into the game. I think George may of posted in the forums earlier on about why the game hasnt updated it its visuals.

Now on the subject of DLC. I think it may be a possibility in the future to add more maps to the game but i guess time will tell

1031982 · 09-01-2008, 11:58 PM

Yes, but I am not talking about an update, but DLC. Making DLC that is JUST updated graphics is possible, and by all means, could be likely. I know from things I read that part of the reason for keeping the same graphics was to allow the original experience to be exactly the same. If I remember correctly, there was the space issue as well. But by making it DLC, they can go higher in terms of space, and most importantly, it would be optional. I would be more then happy to pay for updated graphics, as well as a lot of people that played it when it came out.
I personally hope that the DLC mark could be used for more then just maps. With Pray, they had more people to play as in MP. In GOW, they added graphics to maps just to make them.

Also, If they wanted to do enhanced graphics, one idea (depending on how much RAM is available) could be to use on core to de-compress them and load them into RAM until accessed. There are always tricks to be used. Might be able to get some compression to get the file download to around 75MB, and de-compressed at 200MB as an example.

I realize your logic Sharpie, but I can hope. And with the way the Xbox works, and depending on the building for D3DA, it could be an option for the future. And I would never expect it to be updated to widescreen, that is just insane as I think all the graphic code would need to be built from the ground up, and that is just not smart business.

Stevey Boy · 09-02-2008, 01:30 AM

What, like the HRP?
As Joe has said on here before, thats not 3DRealms` work so I dont think well ever see anything like that, they cant release something that isnt theirs

Steve · 09-02-2008, 03:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1031982

Yes, but I am not talking about an update, but DLC. Making DLC that is JUST updated graphics is possible, and by all means, could be likely. I know from things I read that part of the reason for keeping the same graphics was to allow the original experience to be exactly the same. If I remember correctly, there was the space issue as well. But by making it DLC, they can go higher in terms of space, and most importantly, it would be optional. I would be more then happy to pay for updated graphics, as well as a lot of people that played it when it came out.
I personally hope that the DLC mark could be used for more then just maps. With Pray, they had more people to play as in MP. In GOW, they added graphics to maps just to make them.

3D Realms do not have the resources to re-do all the art tiles. George has already said something in regards to updated graphics - it's a no go. New maps? That's possible. Doesn't matter if you call it an update or DLC. They don't have the resources to do it.

1031982 · 09-02-2008, 12:27 PM

Ah, ok. It's a little disappointing, but still. DN3D is DN3D! I will still be getting it as soon as I see it on Live.

Steve · 09-02-2008, 01:38 PM

Yeah, it kinda sucks for those who want the updated graphics ( I'm not too interested in it

)

1031982 · 09-02-2008, 01:45 PM

I would have liked it as an option. Heaving it as DLC would allow people who wanted it to have it, and people who don't won't have to get anything else.
It's a shame 3DR can't/wont work with the people who made the HRP. But that's the world were in.

Retodon8 · 09-02-2008, 05:08 PM

George's post here.

1031982 · 09-02-2008, 06:26 PM

Now that was an excellent link Retodon8. Good solid explanation, and though I am slightly annoyed it most likely won't happen, it's perfectly understandable. Thanks.

Now I wonder, what will the cost be for the game...

Woutsie · 09-03-2008, 09:29 AM

I don't really care about the graphics. This is Duke3D. The way it is supposed to be!

I do hope they will add DLC in the future, new episodes, maps or whatever...

coolwickidninja · 09-05-2008, 12:58 AM

I like it the way it is keepin it old school oh ya

jagguar20 · 09-06-2008, 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coolwickidninja

I like it the way it is keepin it old school oh ya

Very true!

Dukefan24 · 09-07-2008, 04:37 AM

They should consider adding the community hi-res pack as a downloadable content lol.

Retodon8 · 09-08-2008, 12:57 AM

That (HRP) has been discussed in other threads.
It won't change anything bringing it up again here.

1031982 · 09-08-2008, 11:28 AM

I think the DLC will most likely be the Atomic episode, and multi-player maps. Would like the HRP, but I fully understand the issues getting it done for XBox Live and don't expect it so much any more.

TBZ · 09-08-2008, 11:30 AM

The Birth from Atomic Edition is included in Duke3D for XBLA.

1031982 · 09-08-2008, 11:51 AM

Well then, the only DLC I see coming are more maps.
Thanks for the info TBZ.

Retodon8 · 09-09-2008, 03:10 PM

Actually I see no reason (any official word) to expect any DLC.
The actual game isn't even out yet.
Episode 4 is included and the HRP seems very unlikely.

New maps...?
I don't expect anyone to make any new DN3D maps, and I don't think there have been any official extra maps for the old DN3D.
There were the expansion packs, but those were all done by other companies.

Besides, isn't DN3D enough to keep everyone occupied for a while.

Joe Siegler · 09-09-2008, 05:00 PM

Here's what I said over on the xbox.com forums about that..

I don't think it's feasible. Can't say it's impossible, but from what we learned going through a submission, there's seriously intense rules regarding stuff like this. Microsoft doesn't post anything (rightfully so) until it clears a seriously large list of rules they have regarding content on their console. I cannot see how, given the rules in place, things like Build user levels are a possibility at all.

Squint22 · 09-22-2008, 01:46 PM

Updating graphics is a bad idea.
First off it would take too much time(That 3DR needs for forever)
And second, you take away the sprites and blocky graphics, you take away what made DN3D great in the first place.
Now I think a good idea would be to release "Plug and Pray" as an additional downloadable episode for about 100-200 points.
It was a great episode and I think it would get alot of downloads.

George Broussard · 09-22-2008, 05:46 PM

Also, re: updating graphics.

Even if we had the time, I'm not sure we'd do it. Not without at least offering the original graphics too.

There's something to be said for keeping things classic and in original form. I find that lots of classic game fans enjoy going back in time and seeing the game as they remember it. For new fans that never played the game, I can see their concern. But would you complain because a movie is in B&W vs color?

1031982 · 09-22-2008, 07:52 PM

Again, (I am the topic starter), I fully understand the limitations, and accept that it's not updated. In fact, my question was on the possibility of it being an option!
My conclusion is that it kinda stinks, and that's only because I would have liked to have the option.

As of now, and when I last posted a response, I am not expecting anything in terms of upgraded graphics or even really sound. I am fine with it, but at the same time should something come out where their is DLC that improved on it, I would buy it. I won't go asking for it in any way, shape or form. But I will not ignore it either.

Altered Reality · 09-23-2008, 01:20 PM

Quote:

There's something to be said for keeping things classic and in original form. I find that lots of classic game fans enjoy going back in time and seeing the game as they remember it.

There's another side of the coin: people who remember past things to be much better than they actually were, and feel alienated when they are shown that their memories do not represent the real thing. It never happened to me directly, but I've witnessed this several times.
For example, a friend of mine started gaming with a PS1, and one of his first games was Tekken 3. When he got Tekken 5 and discovered it included the full version of Tekken 3, he got all nostalgic, all "those were good games, those times will never come back"... until he saw it again. That's when he got pissed. He started going "what's this, this is not the real Tekken 3, the real Tekken 3 was much better than this crap, who are they trying to fool" and so on. I tried to convince him that he was wrong, since that was clearly the same game, but words weren't enough, he wouldn't believe me, so I started digging through his old stuff, to find his original Tekken 3 PS1 CD again. When I found it, I said "Put it in and see for yourself." He did. Only then he realized that he remembered something that never existed, not the real game.

Joe Siegler · 09-23-2008, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Altered Reality

There's another side of the coin: people who remember past things to be much better than they actually were, and feel alienated when they are shown that their memories do not represent the real thing. It never happened to me directly, but I've witnessed this several times.
For example, a friend of mine started gaming with a PS1, and one of his first games was Tekken 3. When he got Tekken 5 and discovered it included the full version of Tekken 3, he got all nostalgic, all "those were good games, those times will never come back"... until he saw it again. That's when he got pissed. He started going "what's this, this is not the real Tekken 3, the real Tekken 3 was much better than this crap, who are they trying to fool" and so on. I tried to convince him that he was wrong, since that was clearly the same game, but words weren't enough, he wouldn't believe me, so I started digging through his old stuff, to find his original Tekken 3 PS1 CD again. When I found it, I said "Put it in and see for yourself." He did. Only then he realized that he remembered something that never existed, not the real game.

Those are the same kind of rose color glasses a lot of people viewed the Star Wars prequels through.

Altered Reality · 09-23-2008, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe Siegler

Those are the same kind of rose color glasses a lot of people viewed the Star Wars prequels through.

And which make Duke3D nostalgics say:

Quote:

And second, you take away the sprites and blocky graphics, you take away what made DN3D great in the first place.

So, if it was released with HRP-quality graphics in 1996... it would NOT have been great?

George Broussard · 09-23-2008, 02:26 PM

All that matters, imo, is what was original.

I'm glad Capcom probably spent a million dollars revamping all the art in Bionic Commando. I question it being worth the effort, from a business angle, though. I think they would have sold pretty much the same number of copies with the original art.

pjohnsonjr · 09-24-2008, 12:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George Broussard

All that matters, imo, is what was original.

I'm glad Capcom probably spent a million dollars revamping all the art in Bionic Commando. I question it being worth the effort, from a business angle, though. I think they would have sold pretty much the same number of copies with the original art.

Mega Man 9 was the other side of the coin for that. It received NES graphics

.

Altered Reality · 09-24-2008, 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pjohnsonjr

Mega Man 9 was the other side of the coin for that. It received NES graphics

.

And was laughed at in many gaming forums, because it went TOO far in the other direction.

Retodon8 · 09-24-2008, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by George Broussard

I'm glad Capcom probably spent a million dollars revamping all the art in Bionic Commando. I question it being worth the effort, from a business angle, though. I think they would have sold pretty much the same number of copies with the original art.

Bionic Commando is different though; it was designed from the ground up to be a "new" game.
It's 3D now (not the gameplay), it's not just some new textures and sprites, it has new sounds, boss fights, and so on.
Of course the gameplay remains exactly (?) the same, but you get my point, I hope.

The same goes for Prince of Persia Classic, although that actually had some new gameplay elements like running into and bouncing of walls, climbing up ninja-style.

I like those kinds of remakes.
It depends on the game, but for instance for Joust I would've preferred a remake over the old version.

It's different from DN3D though, because just some new textures would feel added as an afterthought...
Yeah, pretty obvious.

DN3D in its original version can stand on its own.

09-09-2008, 05:00 PM	#20
Joe Siegler 3D Realms Staff	Re: One question, and on comment. Here's what I said over on the xbox.com forums about that.. I don't think it's feasible. Can't say it's impossible, but from what we learned going through a submission, there's seriously intense rules regarding stuff like this. Microsoft doesn't post anything (rightfully so) until it clears a seriously large list of rules they have regarding content on their console. I cannot see how, given the rules in place, things like Build user levels are a possibility at all. __________________ Apogee / 3D Realms Employee: Dec 14, 1992 - May 22, 2009, Oct 23, 2014 - current "Lifting up the Cross to the waiting lost" - Petra \| John 3:16

09-01-2008, 10:54 PM	#1
1031982	One question, and on comment. Ok, I think it's EXELENT this is coming to XBLA. I got points on my account, and am going to buy as soon as I can. That being said, I have seen the vids and pics of it in progress; and I am wondering if later on, th4e dev team will add DLC for updated graphics? By all means, I understand the reason for keeping it how it was, as I said I am buying it right away. But having the option to have updated graphics would be nice. I would like to point out that Luminous has an add on pack at 213MB. Also, with every pack released, and minimal save files, it takes up 886MB. Quite a large game for Arcade with everything, and yet most of it is optional.

09-01-2008, 11:36 PM	#2
Sharpie	Re: One question, and on comment. IMO there is NO way DN3D XBLA will ever see an update that gives it updated graphics. If 3DR had any intentions to have the game with enhanced visuals they would of already incorporated them into the game. I think George may of posted in the forums earlier on about why the game hasnt updated it its visuals. Now on the subject of DLC. I think it may be a possibility in the future to add more maps to the game but i guess time will tell __________________ 360 gamertag: sharpie92 DNF on 360 please http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFct6lg0Vmo <<<< Watch for a laugh

09-01-2008, 11:58 PM	#3
1031982	Re: One question, and on comment. Yes, but I am not talking about an update, but DLC. Making DLC that is JUST updated graphics is possible, and by all means, could be likely. I know from things I read that part of the reason for keeping the same graphics was to allow the original experience to be exactly the same. If I remember correctly, there was the space issue as well. But by making it DLC, they can go higher in terms of space, and most importantly, it would be optional. I would be more then happy to pay for updated graphics, as well as a lot of people that played it when it came out. I personally hope that the DLC mark could be used for more then just maps. With Pray, they had more people to play as in MP. In GOW, they added graphics to maps just to make them. Also, If they wanted to do enhanced graphics, one idea (depending on how much RAM is available) could be to use on core to de-compress them and load them into RAM until accessed. There are always tricks to be used. Might be able to get some compression to get the file download to around 75MB, and de-compressed at 200MB as an example. I realize your logic Sharpie, but I can hope. And with the way the Xbox works, and depending on the building for D3DA, it could be an option for the future. And I would never expect it to be updated to widescreen, that is just insane as I think all the graphic code would need to be built from the ground up, and that is just not smart business.

09-02-2008, 01:30 AM	#4
Stevey Boy	Re: One question, and on comment. What, like the HRP? As Joe has said on here before, thats not 3DRealms` work so I dont think well ever see anything like that, they cant release something that isnt theirs

09-02-2008, 12:27 PM	#6
1031982	Re: One question, and on comment. Ah, ok. It's a little disappointing, but still. DN3D is DN3D! I will still be getting it as soon as I see it on Live.

09-02-2008, 01:38 PM	#7
Steve	Re: One question, and on comment. Yeah, it kinda sucks for those who want the updated graphics ( I'm not too interested in it )

09-02-2008, 01:45 PM	#8
1031982	Re: One question, and on comment. I would have liked it as an option. Heaving it as DLC would allow people who wanted it to have it, and people who don't won't have to get anything else. It's a shame 3DR can't/wont work with the people who made the HRP. But that's the world were in.

09-02-2008, 05:08 PM	#9
Retodon8	Re: One question, and on comment. George's post here. __________________ Retodon8 Sheep happens!

09-02-2008, 06:26 PM	#10
1031982	Re: One question, and on comment. Now that was an excellent link Retodon8. Good solid explanation, and though I am slightly annoyed it most likely won't happen, it's perfectly understandable. Thanks. Now I wonder, what will the cost be for the game...

09-03-2008, 09:29 AM	#11
Woutsie	Re: One question, and on comment. I don't really care about the graphics. This is Duke3D. The way it is supposed to be! I do hope they will add DLC in the future, new episodes, maps or whatever...

09-07-2008, 04:37 AM	#14
Dukefan24	Re: One question, and on comment. They should consider adding the community hi-res pack as a downloadable content lol. __________________ Dukefan24: Another addicted Duke Nukem fan in the world! My Wii Friend Code: 8063 8131 9140 5518 My Website: Duke Nukem Stadium

09-05-2008, 12:58 AM	#12
coolwickidninja	Re: One question, and on comment. I like it the way it is keepin it old school oh ya

09-08-2008, 12:57 AM	#15
Retodon8	Re: One question, and on comment. That (HRP) has been discussed in other threads. It won't change anything bringing it up again here. __________________ Retodon8 Sheep happens!

09-08-2008, 11:28 AM	#16
1031982	Re: One question, and on comment. I think the DLC will most likely be the Atomic episode, and multi-player maps. Would like the HRP, but I fully understand the issues getting it done for XBox Live and don't expect it so much any more.

09-08-2008, 11:30 AM	#17
TBZ	Re: One question, and on comment. The Birth from Atomic Edition is included in Duke3D for XBLA. __________________ After a year in therapy, my psychiatrist said to me, 'Maybe life isn't for everyone.'

09-08-2008, 11:51 AM	#18
1031982	Re: One question, and on comment. Well then, the only DLC I see coming are more maps. Thanks for the info TBZ.

09-09-2008, 03:10 PM	#19
Retodon8	Re: One question, and on comment. Actually I see no reason (any official word) to expect any DLC. The actual game isn't even out yet. Episode 4 is included and the HRP seems very unlikely. New maps...? I don't expect anyone to make any new DN3D maps, and I don't think there have been any official extra maps for the old DN3D. There were the expansion packs, but those were all done by other companies. Besides, isn't DN3D enough to keep everyone occupied for a while. __________________ Retodon8 Sheep happens!

09-22-2008, 01:46 PM	#21
Squint22	Re: One question, and on comment. Updating graphics is a bad idea. First off it would take too much time(That 3DR needs for forever) And second, you take away the sprites and blocky graphics, you take away what made DN3D great in the first place. Now I think a good idea would be to release "Plug and Pray" as an additional downloadable episode for about 100-200 points. It was a great episode and I think it would get alot of downloads.

09-22-2008, 05:46 PM	#22
George Broussard	Re: One question, and on comment. Also, re: updating graphics. Even if we had the time, I'm not sure we'd do it. Not without at least offering the original graphics too. There's something to be said for keeping things classic and in original form. I find that lots of classic game fans enjoy going back in time and seeing the game as they remember it. For new fans that never played the game, I can see their concern. But would you complain because a movie is in B&W vs color?

09-22-2008, 07:52 PM	#23
1031982	Re: One question, and on comment. Again, (I am the topic starter), I fully understand the limitations, and accept that it's not updated. In fact, my question was on the possibility of it being an option! My conclusion is that it kinda stinks, and that's only because I would have liked to have the option. As of now, and when I last posted a response, I am not expecting anything in terms of upgraded graphics or even really sound. I am fine with it, but at the same time should something come out where their is DLC that improved on it, I would buy it. I won't go asking for it in any way, shape or form. But I will not ignore it either.

09-23-2008, 02:26 PM	#27
George Broussard	Re: One question, and on comment. All that matters, imo, is what was original. I'm glad Capcom probably spent a million dollars revamping all the art in Bionic Commando. I question it being worth the effort, from a business angle, though. I think they would have sold pretty much the same number of copies with the original art.