3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" - Page 10

adam cracow · 05-29-2009, 04:11 AM

GB twitter: Having a new garage door installed. One man installation. He makes it look easy. Bet he can't build a PC though!

lordlonelobo · 05-29-2009, 04:24 AM

What if he could, George? What if he could?!

WoodenSword · 05-29-2009, 06:28 AM

George's last twits show that he is very calm about the whole situation....

maybe he has talked to Take two and agreed to settle the case out of court or his lawyers are very confident that the case will be dismissed or something

That Guy · 05-29-2009, 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by adam cracow

GB twitter: Having a new garage door installed. One man installation. He makes it look easy. Bet he can't build a PC though!

Bet it didn't take him 12+ years to FAIL at installing the door either.

Tualmasok · 05-29-2009, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by That Guy

Bet it didn't take him 12+ years to FAIL at installing the door either.

Bahahahahahahahaha!

SNAP!

prophecy holder · 05-29-2009, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by That Guy

Bet it didn't take him 12+ years to FAIL at installing the door either.

He will be switching engines to make the door go faster, but don't you worry he will promise it will be the coolest and most smooth garage door ever.

3rdmillhouse · 05-29-2009, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WoodenSword

George's last twits show that he is very calm about the whole situation....

maybe he has talked to Take two and agreed to settle the case out of court or his lawyers are very confident that the case will be dismissed or something

Bet he's in denial, trying to pretend the whole ordeal didn't happen.

Quote:

Originally Posted by That Guy

Bet it didn't take him 12+ years to FAIL at installing the door either.

Oh snap, EPIC pwnage there at it's best,gentlemen.

Jiminator · 05-29-2009, 12:45 PM

eh, ease up guys, as much as you might complain about the game you did not get to play, this is someone's company that has gone down the toilet. No need to be cruel.

SplatterHappy · 05-29-2009, 01:08 PM

If 3DR doesn't want to see anything cruel posted about this mess, they'd be better off just shutting down the forums, unfortunately.

prophecy holder · 05-29-2009, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SplatterHappy

If 3DR doesn't want to see anything cruel posted about this mess, they'd be better off just shutting down the forums, unfortunately.

Too bad there is the rest of the internet, so 3DR has to close down the interwebs to not see anything bad posted about them.

zeki · 05-31-2009, 02:40 AM

im amazed and slightly shocked by the endless faith of the duke nukem fans
on this forum. you blow any religious fanatic out of the water, tenfold

jaimie10 · 05-31-2009, 03:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zeki

im amazed and slightly shocked by the endless faith of the duke nukem fans
on this forum. you blow any religious fanatic out of the water, tenfold

Yeah I think it's called denial. There are 2 options for the future of DNF:

1)Project DNF will be cancelled
2)Redevelopment of DNF will commence late 2010 once court case has finished, with potential release date 2012.

What some people seem to think that there is some kind of hoax and DNF is going to appear at E3 or that GB is suddenly going to find 5 million under his pillow or something like that. If they could accept the above scenarios i think they'd pretty quickly turn on GB & 3DR. In GBs mind DNF will be completed at some stage. The reality is that when/if development ever commenced on DNF we will be 2 years further on from where we're at and a further 2 years from completion. I don't care how good a game is, it will date in 4 years. You look back at games from 2002/2003 and yeah some of them are great, but they look old. When that realisation dawns on GB he will just can the project. Whats the point in pumping more and more money into something that has tech from 5 years ago?

Babe · 05-31-2009, 06:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zeki

im amazed and slightly shocked by the endless faith of the duke nukem fans on this forum. you blow any religious fanatic out of the water, tenfold

There is a slight difference though. Religion is all fictitious story for adults, like Santa Claus is for kids. DNF on the other hand has real exisence, although not in final releasable form, but it does exist in semi finished form.

StrikerMan780 · 05-31-2009, 06:59 AM

EVERYBODY.... Stop Kicking the Wounded man while he's down(3DR in this Case). For Christ Sakes. Ease up, and get the f*cking sticks/dildos/barbed wire out your asses.

We don't know the fate of the game until the lawsuit is done... until then, shut the f*ck up. We don't know DNF is dead for certain yet.

Christ, the Amount of Blind Fanboyism, and the Blind Hate and Spite on the other end of the spectrum as well is all pissing me off and is about to throw me over the f*cking deep end of insanity.

EVERYBODY should shut the F*ck up until later.

GAH!

jaimie10 · 05-31-2009, 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StrikerMan780

EVERYBODY.... Stop Kicking the Wounded man while he's down(3DR in this Case). For Christ Sakes. Ease up, and get the f*cking sticks/dildos/barbed wire out your asses.

We don't know the fate of the game until the lawsuit is done... until then, shut the f*ck up. We don't know DNF is dead for certain yet.

Christ, the Amount of Blind Fanboyism, and the Blind Hate and Spite on the other end of the spectrum as well is all pissing me off and is about to throw me over the f*cking deep end of insanity.

EVERYBODY should shut the F*ck up until later.

GAH!

You are mistaking criticism and realism for 'blind hate'. It has been mentioned in the media that the court case will be 12 months from now. Lets say it takes 4 or 5 months for the court case to finish, thats late 2010. Now for arguments sake lets assume 3DR win, they then go out and try and put together a new DNf team and complete the game. So BEST case scenario is DNF will be finished 2012. Gb would have to be stupid to think that he can ship DNF in 2012 and still think it's 'mind-blowing'. I'm still waiting to hear from someone how DNF can be released before 2012?

Monkey Butler · 05-31-2009, 08:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaimie10

Now for arguments sake lets assume 3DR win, they then go out and try and put together a new DNf team and complete the game.

While I agree in theory with your future timeline, it's entirely dependent on two things: 1. T2 and 3DR don't come to a settlement before or during the trial and 2. even if 3DR don't lose, they still have to find an investor willing to pony up the rumoured $5 million. I somehow doubt that people with the ability to part with that much cash would have the kind of blind fanboyism of the people on the internet.

3rdmillhouse · 05-31-2009, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monkey Butler

While I agree in theory with your future timeline, it's entirely dependent on two things: 1. T2 and 3DR don't come to a settlement before or during the trial and 2. even if 3DR don't lose, they still have to find an investor willing to pony up the rumoured $5 million. I somehow doubt that people with the ability to part with that much cash would have the kind of blind fanboyism of the people on the internet.

Good thing is they (as in 3dRealms) have an engine that's supposedly as kickass as the Unreal Engine 3, so, maybe they outsource their engine to one competent studio to develop a new Duke game.

Quote:

Originally Posted by StrikerMan780

EVERYBODY.... Stop Kicking the Wounded man while he's down(3DR in this Case). For Christ Sakes. Ease up, and get the f*cking sticks/dildos/barbed wire out your asses.

But,get this, kick him hard enough and he might just get up with a vengeance.

SplatterHappy · 05-31-2009, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3rdmillhouse

Good thing is they (as in 3dRealms) have an engine that's supposedly as kickass as the Unreal Engine 3, so, maybe they outsource their engine to one competent studio to develop a new Duke game.

Not going to happen for one reason: While it's heavily modified, it's base is still Epic's Unreal Engine (2?) code.. Epic would sue.

3rdmillhouse · 05-31-2009, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SplatterHappy

Not going to happen for one reason: While it's heavily modified, it's base is still Epic's Unreal Engine (2?) code.. Epic would sue.

Not unless royalties are paid. But most likely that part wasn't covered in licensing agreement. I recall reading somewhere that along 95% of the original source code fo the engine was rewritten, so that now, it's a completely different engine. But guess we just have to speculate, since GB i not a big fan of disclosing development details with the community.

jet jaguar 2.0 · 05-31-2009, 10:19 AM

The only way I see a quick resolution and continued DNF developement is if there is some serious renegotiation on 3DR's part regarding how big a cut Take Two gets with DNF's sales. Maybe, MAYBE, if they can convince Take Two that Duke still has the ability to sell like crazy across multiple platforms(pc, 360) then maybe Take Two drops the case and throws more cash at 3DR. Take Two already has big money invested in DNF and I don't see other publishers waiting to pay a king's ransom to not only buy the publishing rights from Take Two but help finance DNF's completion.

SplatterHappy · 06-01-2009, 12:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jet jaguar 2.0

The only way I see a quick resolution and continued DNF developement is if there is some serious renegotiation on 3DR's part regarding how big a cut Take Two gets with DNF's sales. Maybe, MAYBE, if they can convince Take Two that Duke still has the ability to sell like crazy across multiple platforms(pc, 360) then maybe Take Two drops the case and throws more cash at 3DR. Take Two already has big money invested in DNF and I don't see other publishers waiting to pay a king's ransom to not only buy the publishing rights from Take Two but help finance DNF's completion.

There's still alot of questions as to exactly what dollar figure Take Two has invested in DNF. Even that $2.5 million figure is supposedly "in connection" with some other unannounced game. I expect the exact figures will come out in the trial.

But I agree with you wholeheartedly.. it all comes down to money. If 3DR sweetens the deal and agrees to a "must ship by" completion date, then Take Two will in all likelyhood drop the case and throw some funding in 3DR's direction. Both sides have to give a little for this to happen though, IMO.

Tualmasok · 06-01-2009, 01:15 AM

TBH, it doesn't come down to money, it comes down to greed.

Take 2 want more money to fill their coffers. 3DR wanted more money to finish the game.

3DR asked for more money to finish the game, Take 2 responded by wanting to overtake the entire franchise on their terms.

Go figure?!?

PS. Still doesn't affect the fact that 3DR should have been properly managed and produced at least *one* game by now.

Monkey Butler · 06-01-2009, 01:49 AM

I wouldn't call it greed so much as dickish opportunism. T2 saw a previously valuable franchise and a failing and mismanaged development company and that equals dollar signs. They had no obligation to give any sort of funding to 3DR (especially when 3DR had told them to 'STFU' and had continually trumpeted their independent status) and so probably thought they could make 3DR roll over easily. Obviously they didn't take into account the stubbornness and sense of entitlement of a guy who'll keep working on a single game for so long.

Vinsane · 06-01-2009, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monkey Butler

I wouldn't call it greed so much as dickish opportunism. T2 saw a previously valuable franchise and a failing and mismanaged development company and that equals dollar signs. They had no obligation to give any sort of funding to 3DR (especially when 3DR had told them to 'STFU' and had continually trumpeted their independent status) and so probably thought they could make 3DR roll over easily. Obviously they didn't take into account the stubbornness and sense of entitlement of a guy who'll keep working on a single game for so long.

I agree. Wounded prey, easy kill. G.B. played his hand well imo.

Monkey Butler · 06-02-2009, 04:08 AM

I dunno, IMO 'well' would have been negotiating more money for the IP or some sort of development deal in exchange for the IP or something. At the moment it's like he's taken his ball and gone home, at the expense of the 3DR staff. He gets to keep the IP, but that's it. Depending on how willing T2 were to negotiate, he could have set himself, and his company and staff members up for life. You could talk a bout 'principles' all you like, but as it stands now the company's effectively shut down and has got pretty much the worst reputation in the industry.

lordlonelobo · 06-02-2009, 05:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monkey Butler

I dunno, IMO 'well' would have been negotiating more money for the IP or some sort of development deal in exchange for the IP or something. At the moment it's like he's taken his ball and gone home, at the expense of the 3DR staff. He gets to keep the IP, but that's it. Depending on how willing T2 were to negotiate, he could have set himself, and his company and staff members up for life. You could talk a bout 'principles' all you like, but as it stands now the company's effectively shut down and has got pretty much the worst reputation in the industry.

Apparently they were negotiating that, but Take 2 decided to make some changes to their agreement which wasn't fair or acceptable to 3DR.

Everyone makes it sound like 3DR just decided to ask for money, Take 2 said no, and 3DR just decided to call it quits.

I'm not a huge 3DR fan, for example, I'm not 100% certain DNF will come out, and they had their mistakes, but for the most part, none of us know exactly what happened and why, so none of us are really entitled to comment.

As for the DNF team, well, when you join a company, you have to be prepared for the worst case scenario. Unfortunate as it may be, it happened, and they'll have to deal.

Fans, well, really you have no "right" to complain, it's understandable why you would. I'm surprised 3DR is letting such comments go on their own boards, and yet censor certain swear words.

Either way, we don't know the official story of anything, so let's just sit down and see what happens. If 3DR survives the lawsuit in any method, and co-license games based on Duke, chances are we may see DNF at some point. Enough jokes about 2055 and whatever guys, I'm sure you can come up with more original jokes than that.

Regardless of how graphics date, gameplay is the cornerstone of games. For example, DN3D, despite having extremely outdated graphics, is available on Xbox LIVE Arcade, and is obviously selling reasonably well enough George is willing to give free copies out.

That's got to mean something.

Monkey Butler · 06-02-2009, 08:21 AM

I understand all that, but to say George "played his hand well" is pretty indefensible. I mean, for all we know there could have been absolutely no other option, but I can't really see how losing all staff and halting production can be defined as a good thing.

Needle · 06-02-2009, 02:05 PM

After reading this for a while I have a question:
So it's cool now to idolize publishers for gambling and maximizing their profits while stepping over corpses of lowly developers? I have to know, because I want to be one of the cool guys.

Lt.Havoc · 06-02-2009, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Needle

After reading this for a while I have a question:
So it's cool now to idolize publishers for gambling and maximizing their profits while stepping over corpses of lowly developers? I have to know, because I want to be one of the cool guys.

Well, yes it is, because ya know....no DNF and all.....its all Brussard´s fault and Take 2 i just doing business as usual. I mean, comon, EA did it with Westwood too and see where they are now! So, let Take 2 have the fun as well. It can nly be good for 3DR!

(that was sarcasm btw)

Jiminator · 06-02-2009, 02:29 PM

just an interesting note: valve is going to spend 10 million in advertising left4dead 2. So the 5 mil to continue is somewhat small potatoes. ok, now you can go back to your whining and bashing of 3DR.

lonedogger · 06-02-2009, 08:04 PM

20 mil and no game. the government must have taken over sometime ago. how about some bailout money? maybe we can get 3dr to look like a bank or something. do you make cars?
What did government want you to do make it alien friendly? did they want you to sit down with the aliens first and talk to them and apologize to them for blowing some of them away? trying to make it a friendly game eh....I would have quit too. It goes to show you when you don't have organization you loose! gee you could have gone and bought a fricken island with that money and lived good for the rest of your life. fricken idiots! DNF forever never! see ya losers

WoodenSword · 06-03-2009, 01:29 PM

Do we know how many (and who) are left working for 3d realms, anyway?

Alhexx · 06-04-2009, 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WoodenSword

Do we know how many (and who) are left working for 3d realms, anyway?

IIRC, Joe said that only George Broussard, Scott Miller and Steve (Blackburn?) are left...

Vinsane · 06-04-2009, 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monkey Butler

I understand all that, but to say George "played his hand well" is pretty indefensible. I mean, for all we know there could have been absolutely no other option, but I can't really see how losing all staff and halting production can be defined as a good thing.

You would see things a whole lot differently if you owned/created DNF, at any stage of development. That said, wouldn't it be you who calls the shots? So like the old saying goes, to make an omlet, ya gotta break a few eggs. Surely if G.B. gets a deal that's acceptable to him, I think he would re-hire most if not all his staff back to work.

Caine · 06-04-2009, 01:49 AM

they ruined themselves, or george mostly and took the other devs with them, we dont know all facts or many facts at all but devwork is like a freelance work and if it's true that the devs had a great time they should have also known a bit how 3drealms is handled, 12 years without a game? hmmmmmmmm they could perhaps also see this coming of course.

05-29-2009, 04:11 AM	#361
adam cracow	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" GB twitter: Having a new garage door installed. One man installation. He makes it look easy. Bet he can't build a PC though!

05-29-2009, 04:24 AM	#362
lordlonelobo	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" What if he could, George? What if he could?!

05-29-2009, 06:28 AM	#363
WoodenSword	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" George's last twits show that he is very calm about the whole situation.... maybe he has talked to Take two and agreed to settle the case out of court or his lawyers are very confident that the case will be dismissed or something __________________ ------------------------------ When the chess game is over, the pawn and the king go back to the same box

05-29-2009, 12:45 PM	#368
Jiminator	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" eh, ease up guys, as much as you might complain about the game you did not get to play, this is someone's company that has gone down the toilet. No need to be cruel. __________________ big badass nasty weapons here....

05-29-2009, 01:08 PM	#369
SplatterHappy	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" If 3DR doesn't want to see anything cruel posted about this mess, they'd be better off just shutting down the forums, unfortunately. __________________ "They say everyone gets their 15 minutes of fame. What they don't tell you is that 12 of those minutes are a rectal exam." - John Oliver - "The Daily Show"

05-31-2009, 02:40 AM	#371
zeki	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" im amazed and slightly shocked by the endless faith of the duke nukem fans on this forum. you blow any religious fanatic out of the water, tenfold

05-31-2009, 06:59 AM	#374
StrikerMan780	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" EVERYBODY.... Stop Kicking the Wounded man while he's down(3DR in this Case). For Christ Sakes. Ease up, and get the fcking sticks/dildos/barbed wire out your asses. We don't know the fate of the game until the lawsuit is done... until then, shut the fck up. We don't know DNF is dead for certain yet. Christ, the Amount of Blind Fanboyism, and the Blind Hate and Spite on the other end of the spectrum as well is all pissing me off and is about to throw me over the fcking deep end of insanity. EVERYBODY should shut the Fck up until later. GAH!

05-31-2009, 10:19 AM	#380
jet jaguar 2.0	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" The only way I see a quick resolution and continued DNF developement is if there is some serious renegotiation on 3DR's part regarding how big a cut Take Two gets with DNF's sales. Maybe, MAYBE, if they can convince Take Two that Duke still has the ability to sell like crazy across multiple platforms(pc, 360) then maybe Take Two drops the case and throws more cash at 3DR. Take Two already has big money invested in DNF and I don't see other publishers waiting to pay a king's ransom to not only buy the publishing rights from Take Two but help finance DNF's completion. __________________ Resident Evil 4 + Orgazmo = Now you're a Mwwwaan!

06-01-2009, 01:15 AM	#382
Tualmasok	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" TBH, it doesn't come down to money, it comes down to greed. Take 2 want more money to fill their coffers. 3DR wanted more money to finish the game. 3DR asked for more money to finish the game, Take 2 responded by wanting to overtake the entire franchise on their terms. Go figure?!? PS. Still doesn't affect the fact that 3DR should have been properly managed and produced at least one game by now.

06-01-2009, 01:49 AM	#383
Monkey Butler	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" I wouldn't call it greed so much as dickish opportunism. T2 saw a previously valuable franchise and a failing and mismanaged development company and that equals dollar signs. They had no obligation to give any sort of funding to 3DR (especially when 3DR had told them to 'STFU' and had continually trumpeted their independent status) and so probably thought they could make 3DR roll over easily. Obviously they didn't take into account the stubbornness and sense of entitlement of a guy who'll keep working on a single game for so long.

06-02-2009, 04:08 AM	#385
Monkey Butler	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" I dunno, IMO 'well' would have been negotiating more money for the IP or some sort of development deal in exchange for the IP or something. At the moment it's like he's taken his ball and gone home, at the expense of the 3DR staff. He gets to keep the IP, but that's it. Depending on how willing T2 were to negotiate, he could have set himself, and his company and staff members up for life. You could talk a bout 'principles' all you like, but as it stands now the company's effectively shut down and has got pretty much the worst reputation in the industry.

06-02-2009, 08:21 AM	#387
Monkey Butler	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" I understand all that, but to say George "played his hand well" is pretty indefensible. I mean, for all we know there could have been absolutely no other option, but I can't really see how losing all staff and halting production can be defined as a good thing.

06-02-2009, 02:05 PM	#388
Needle	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" After reading this for a while I have a question: So it's cool now to idolize publishers for gambling and maximizing their profits while stepping over corpses of lowly developers? I have to know, because I want to be one of the cool guys.

06-02-2009, 02:29 PM	#390
Jiminator	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" just an interesting note: valve is going to spend 10 million in advertising left4dead 2. So the 5 mil to continue is somewhat small potatoes. ok, now you can go back to your whining and bashing of 3DR. __________________ big badass nasty weapons here....

06-02-2009, 08:04 PM	#391
lonedogger	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" 20 mil and no game. the government must have taken over sometime ago. how about some bailout money? maybe we can get 3dr to look like a bank or something. do you make cars? What did government want you to do make it alien friendly? did they want you to sit down with the aliens first and talk to them and apologize to them for blowing some of them away? trying to make it a friendly game eh....I would have quit too. It goes to show you when you don't have organization you loose! gee you could have gone and bought a fricken island with that money and lived good for the rest of your life. fricken idiots! DNF forever never! see ya losers

06-03-2009, 01:29 PM	#392
WoodenSword	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" Do we know how many (and who) are left working for 3d realms, anyway? __________________ ------------------------------ When the chess game is over, the pawn and the king go back to the same box

06-04-2009, 01:49 AM	#395
Caine	Re: 3DR "smaller studio now," "will continue to operate as a company" they ruined themselves, or george mostly and took the other devs with them, we dont know all facts or many facts at all but devwork is like a freelance work and if it's true that the devs had a great time they should have also known a bit how 3drealms is handled, 12 years without a game? hmmmmmmmm they could perhaps also see this coming of course.