So what do Native Americans think of Prey.

[Geronimo]

I haven't herd any news about what Native Americans think about Prey. As far as I know this is the first game to have a Native American lead character so I figure they'd be interested. I was curious as to why we haven't herd anything from that community. Or has it just not reached the white press?

[brandon105]

They like it, cause one of them posted here the other day, he is a police officer. ect

[Orochi Avlis]

As far as I know this is the first game to have a Native American lead character so I figure they'd be interested

It is, but Turok was released before Prey was. So technically Turok is the first game to have a native american hero.

[Kristian Joensen]

But couldn't he just as well have been something other than that ? Was he authentic ?

[Orochi Avlis]

Not by a long shot. There wasn't any ties to actual native american heritage.

So yea, they could have used anybody in his place and it would still be the same.

[Danule]

they could have done the same thing with prey, instead of being native american he could have been any old joe who smokes some DMT and goes into the "spirit realm",

[Deep Six]

Originally Posted by Danule

they could have done the same thing with prey, instead of being native american he could have been any old joe who smokes some DMT and goes into the "spirit realm",

Yeah, and his quest wouldn't be to save his girlfriend and the world, it would be to turn the sphere into the universe's largest intergalactic meth lab.

[Joe Siegler]

Originally Posted by Danule

they could have done the same thing with prey, instead of being native american he could have been any old joe who smokes some DMT and goes into the "spirit realm",

Hey!

[Danule]

Originally Posted by Joe Siegler

Hey!

im sorry i should have mentioned i was talking about you :P

[Geronimo]

Umm...So like nobody has any idea what Native Americans think of the game? I mean it's not very often you get a Cherokee as a lead character in a game.

[IRO-bot]

I am part Apache and i have no problem with it. I think it is awesome. I mean a game is a game, nothing more then that. It is there to provide entertainment. I dont want to turn into a Jack Thompson or whatev that guys name is.

[Brutal Assassin]

Lol, I do hope the thread creator wasn't hoping for a native american's response :P

Given that such a small percent of people of native american descent exist, and the fact that only a portion of that percent play video games, and that only a portion of THAT percent will play Prey and only a portion of THAT percent would end up on the forums.

Unless, of course, Prey made the news. Then all of the sudden there would be offended native americans coming out of the woodworks with law suit threats, I'm sure.

EDIT: Well, what are the odds. Someone who is part apache posts at the same time I am typing. My god...LOL

[Phait]

Originally Posted by brandon105

They like it, cause one of them posted here the other day, he is a police officer. ect

One person's opinions don't speak for the rest of their kind. Don't ever assume that about anything.

[hanged_man]

I dont there's anything offending to red indians in this game ...on the contrary, it reminds us that there are native americans out there

[Needle]

I've already seen (supposedly) native americans bitch about it on other forums.

[Micki!]

Well, the two voice actors, making voices for Tommy and Jen, are both native americans, and they obviously like it...

[WVa Cherokee]

I came across this game yesterday when I was bored and browsing through the Xbox Live Marketplace. Downloaded the demo and was really excited to see not only an Indian, but a Cherokee (I am Cherokee if you haven't guessed by my username ) as the "hero". Naturally my first thought was, "ok, what'd they screw up." Let's face it, the entertainment industry doesn't have a good track record when it comes to showing the real face of Indian people.

Even though I've only played the demo, I have to say that with the exception of a few points, I am pretty happy about the Cherokee representation within the game. Are there Indians looking to "get off the rez" because they feel like they are going nowhere? Sure. Are there Indians who turn their back on their heritage? Unfortunately yes. Are there Indians who come back to their heritage? You bet. Are there Indians who want to stay due to family, tribe, etc? Of course.

That is what I was happy about. With the exception of Enisi wearing buckskin as everyday clothing (which I have seen NO ONE every do), Jen and Tommy were just modern everyday Indians doing everyday stuff. They weren't in a tipi and muttering "me smok'um peace pipe" or any crap like that.

I am curious as to what Enisi's name really is. Enisi is the Cherokee word for someone who is addressing their paternal grandfather and is not a name. Though the devs only had Tommy's perspective in using the term, they may just have decided to go with Enisi for the sake of the players.

Another is Jen praying to "yo-nee-gwa" as the "Great Spirit/Creator" (well, Tommy makes the reference to the Great Spirit in referring to Jen praying). To me that sounds like a mispronunciation of "yonegwa" (yo-neh-gwa) which is a contraction of yona (bear) and egwa (great or huge) and is therefore Great Bear. The Creator is called unehlanvhi (oo-neh-hla-nuh-hee).

Again, other than those little points, I was really glad to see an everyday Indian portrayed though how much stereotypical stuff will emerge will only be known when I can play the rest of the game.

[KaiserSoze]

Originally Posted by WVa Cherokee

Again, other than those little points, I was really glad to see an everyday Indian portrayed though how much stereotypical stuff will emerge will only be known when I can play the rest of the game.

Nice post and very informing!

3drealms and Humanhead have stated they are treating the portrayal of Native Americans with the utmost respect and did do alot of research into the culture to make sure they "got things right".

I'm glad we're not playing yet another special agent/cop/military "hero".

It's definately a nice change of pace.

Originally Posted by KaiserSoze

Nice post and very informing!



I'm glad we're not playing yet another special agent/cop/military "hero".

It's definately a nice change of pace.

you said it!

[garland81]

Hey Injun (or WVa Cherokee). Am a ojibway native here. Posted my 2 cents on this post:

http://forums.3drealms.com/vb/showthread.php?t=19445

I agree with alot pretty much everything u said up there about natives and rezzes. I may have to agree with Needle also that some natives will gripe about companies making money off native-y stories. I'll talk about that in a minute.

The portrayal of realistic natives is a very, very daunting task.. that even the greatest of actors will have alot of trouble emulating.. reasons that were directly tied to the native language itself, its perceptions, and mentality behind it which could only be felt, that the only people who can really fully grasp it are the natives who were born into a world of native speaking people. Knowing that, it wouldn't surprise me that non-natives would screw up a bit when trying to properly portraying native characters, lol. Either the spiritual rhythm is always with you or never at all. :P Sounds like a Jedi thing

To Needle, I believe it when you say some natives would gripe about Prey being released.. not because of proper portraiture of native people but because some feel that buying and/or selling of native art is the selling of the soul, pieces taken out of you just so big corporations would make money.

I personally think that's ridiculous for two reasons.

1. The way I was brought up is that the spirit can never leave you no matter how much you try to give it away and you can never lose pieces of it when you create art, but instead it leaves fingerprints behind of what the spirit can create. The spirit is eternal and will forever be.. long after the sun burns out.

2. The concept of money is really just an illusion of what it really is: "Trading Points". Everyone works by providing a service by utilizing the skills one knows that contributes to society.. and after you contributed so much, you are rewarded with money (trading points) in which you can trade for goods you require that other people created.. and all the money that is earned is recycled back into the society. Then, some idiot thought that was power. Lol.

I laugh because Power is dependancy and that makes power an illusion. Big corporates are solely dependant on their customers to buy their products and if they screw up, their company plummets. Which also means power is really just 'capability' and 'responsibility'. You are capable of doing stuff but you are responsible of the action you took.

In the end, I really don't care if they make money off of it because it'll all get recycled eventually and a corporation will have provided a gorgeous product that may (or may not) be forever in the memories of gamers. Time will tell.

Looks fade, money is spent, knowledge fades into oblivion.. and all you have left is who you are and the memories you leave behind.

[WVa Cherokee]

Originally Posted by garland81

The portrayal of realistic natives is a very, very daunting task.. that even the greatest of actors will have alot of trouble emulating.. reasons that were directly tied to the native language itself, its perceptions, and mentality behind it which could only be felt, that the only people who can really fully grasp it are the natives who were born into a world of native speaking people. Knowing that, it wouldn't surprise me that non-natives would screw up a bit when trying to properly portraying native characters, lol.

Exactly. So long as there is an honest effort is all I look for . I was pleasantly suprised at what I saw. To look at it from another angle, let's say that there is a Mafia game that a company develops. Then let's say that a real Mafia member plays it. No doubt they are going to shake their head and laugh at some of the bits in the game hehe.

[CameO73]

1. The way I was brought up is that the spirit can never leave you no matter how much you try to give it away and you can never lose pieces of it when you create art, but instead it leaves fingerprints behind of what the spirit can create. The spirit is eternal and will forever be.. long after the sun burns out.

I'm no native American, but I wholeheartedly agree with your statement.

[Kalki]

Originally Posted by garland81

1. The way I was brought up is that the spirit can never leave you no matter how much you try to give it away and you can never lose pieces of it when you create art, but instead it leaves fingerprints behind of what the spirit can create. The spirit is eternal and will forever be.. long after the sun burns out.

I'm a different kind of Indian(South Asia) and many of us believe the same thing. Actually we've got a Great Spirit too and it's so omnipotent, it is representative of Everything. The Universe, humans, living beings, all matter, energy, etc. and even that which may be beyond the Universe. So to look at it one way, you're leaving your fingerprints on the Greater spirit. But it's a part of you too so you're never losing anything.

ah yeah, ahshera, ah yaeh = Iam that I am= from the great spirit, to flesh, back to great spirit. well thats what some spiritual guy said, hey it led thousands out to the desert to look for a burning bush. i love all spiritual stuff. somewhere there is an answer to all questions, some call it the akasha records some call "him" the angle gabriel. what do the native americans call"it"?

[tom12]

. . edit . . never mind, speculative

[Nashoba]

I'm Choctaw/Cherokee and I think it's great to see American Indians in a leading roll in video games.

Do I expect it to be culturally accurate...no...the final game will probably be filled with the same New Agey fluff that always seems to be associated with American Indians.

What I do like, at least from the demo...is that it gets enough stuff right (i.e. feeling the res will take him no where, his girlfriend feeling tied to her land and people, etc) for me to relate to the main character and being able to sympathise with the hero of a story is important no matter what the tale or how accurate.

Hopefully they will do a decent treatment of the characters, but if not...it is still shaping up to be a fun game.....if they don't portray my people accurately....so what...it's just fiction, it's not like it's a documentary.... (though what Tommy goes through is the same right of passage we all natives go through....we all have to save our Significant Other after being abducted by aliens in order to be considered an adult...allright...who told the white man our secrets??? j/k) LOL

[Gideon]

Who cares? You never hear anybody asking what white guys think of games like Hitman. I mean really, this sensitivity crap is getting old. Prey is a good game that happens to have an indian (can we still call them that?) lead character, and I think it portrays him in an average manor. Typical normal guy that happens to be caught up in horrendous circumstances. The fact that he's a native american doesn't mean we automatically have to be super-sensative about it.

[garland81]

To Kalki: During my studies of native sociology, there has been remarkable similarities to other native-like people in other places such as the natives of australia (who shared a history of warring with settlers and put into residential schools), the tribes people of New Zealand (shared beliefs of the 'Healing Circle'), and some similarities to the bushmen of Africa (cant name anything off hand). It wouldn't surprise me if you saw similarities in beliefs or ceremonies etc.. but does bring a smile to my face.

To Nashoba: Hey Injun. The thing I really found intriguing about Prey was the fact it blended two concepts together. The Supernatural (spirits/ghosts) and the Paranormal (aliens). It's a nice blend of two opposing natures: Science vs Spirituality. One about proof.. the other about faith.

To Gideon: ................... *scalps* j/k :P oh and Indians are from India. We're natives :P

[wildcatchimp2]

Why is everything rascist now. You call a guy Black it's racist if a black guy calls you a cracker its a slang term. Call a native american an indian it's racist. A native calls you the white man it's fine. From know on I want to be called an Italian,german,polish,luthwanian american and if anyone calls me anything different I'm going to call them a racist [/sarcasim]

[garland81]

Well.. wildcat there's a fine line between racism and inaccuracies and like I said in my other post, it's the context of the word.. how its used which makes it racist or not, for all words are neutral. Some people don't recognize what's racist and what isn't. Calling a guy black isn't racist as its more of a form of identification, but to say he's black with a disdainful tone implies that he is inferior.. which is actually racist.

Calling a native an indian isn't racist.. its just inaccurate.

[Gideon]

Up until Pollitical Correctness reared it's ugly head, indians were called indians for several hundred years, forgive me if I can't adapt to the current term. But still, I've got nothing against any other race, but I do have a problem with *****footing around their sensitivities.

[sindex]

At least we are all Omnivores, unless certain people only think “veggie” and think their getting some good protein out of beans and nuts; and as for the people on those Atkins diet watch your heart. Yes, I know that statement was a bit odd but hey it’s “free speech” at its best. Peace out man.

[Laz]

Originally Posted by Gideon

Who cares?

Hmm, the name of the topic is 'So what do Native Americans think of Prey'. Apparently the topic creator cares. As do I. I've picked up a little knowledge from reading some of these posts that I normally wouldn't have came across. Keep up the angry white guy routine. Since I believe in equality and such:

Gideon, how do you feel about the portrayal of caucasians in the video game Hitman?

[avatar_58]

Originally Posted by garland81

2. The concept of money is really just an illusion of what it really is: "Trading Points". Everyone works by providing a service by utilizing the skills one knows that contributes to society.. and after you contributed so much, you are rewarded with money (trading points) in which you can trade for goods you require that other people created.. and all the money that is earned is recycled back into the society. Then, some idiot thought that was power. Lol.

I laugh because Power is dependancy and that makes power an illusion. Big corporates are solely dependant on their customers to buy their products and if they screw up, their company plummets. Which also means power is really just 'capability' and 'responsibility'. You are capable of doing stuff but you are responsible of the action you took.

In the end, I really don't care if they make money off of it because it'll all get recycled eventually and a corporation will have provided a gorgeous product that may (or may not) be forever in the memories of gamers. Time will tell.

Looks fade, money is spent, knowledge fades into oblivion.. and all you have left is who you are and the memories you leave behind.

Insightful post. I happen to agree with some of it, as 'power' is usually what clouds judgement and is the root of many social problems.

I think Prey is great for going beyond the age old american marine and choosing a more diverse hero. Sure Turok already had a native, but if anything that game just reeked of sterotypes. Prey, on the other hand, at least pays respect to its subject matter.

[CameO73]

At least we are all Omnivores, unless certain people only think “veggie” and think their getting some good protein out of beans and nuts;

It's these racist remarks we veggies must not tolerate anymore!

But I agree with garland81's post: it all comes down to intention. And that is something that can be felt without the words.

[Gideon]

Originally Posted by Laz

Gideon, how do you feel about the portrayal of caucasians in the video game Hitman?

I don't. Doesn't make any difference to me what color he is. He's a character in a video game, He's a bad guy killing bad people, I don't feel like the game creators are saying whitey is bad.

I just think it's sad that just because a native american is the lead character in the game, that it will spark outcry in the media. They'll find someone that won't like it and put them on TV.

I think the game would be just as cool if he were a black guy, a white guy or whatever. The only thing that would suffer is the whole spirit walk thing and naturally it'd change the story a bit.

I think it's a good thing that it's a native american, cuz I loved Turok too, but anybody that sees anything negative in this is looking for a reason to whine.

[WVa Cherokee]

The main reason Indian people are glad to see things like this is because they are almost never depicted in a non-Hollywood format. With that being the case, it feels good to see an Indian actor not playing a "Hollywood Indian" (think Wes Studi in "Mystery Men") or the hero of a video game as an Indian. This almost never happens so it is cool to see. If it happened on a more regular basis, the "neat" factor would no doubt wear off. It isn't about sensitivity.

I saw in another thread here that someone was complaining about how being proud of an Indian heritage (as in the game) was unnecessary and that if someone proclaimed being proud of being white that it would be "frowned upon". I'll try to explain a bit here. I know more people and family than I can count that went to Indian boarding schools and were forced to learn English and become Christian. They were told they were heathen, pagan, savages, etc. Those older people went through this and because of it, wanted their young people to feel proud, not ashamed as they were made to feel at times.

I also have a large number of white friends who are proud of what they are whether it is Irish, white American, French, etc. The only groups that I know of that are "frowned upon" by mainstream society for being proud of being white are the white supremicist groups. I also have mixed blood friends who are proud of their heritages.

One thing I have noticed is that so many people are quick to play the "he/she is playing the race card" card whether that person is playing that "card" or not. To me, they are just as bad as someone who plays the race card just to cause trouble. These people come from all groups...just like all groups have their good people as well as their goobers.

Back to the game, I saw a review saying that this game was based on authentic Cherokee "mythology" (as they call it). I can't wait to see how that works out though no doubt some things will be fudged or added for the sake of gameplay.

[Daewoodrow]

You know what, that's why i'm "Proud" of being mixed race (white british and Black caribbean). At the end of the day mixed race people have nothing to live up to, because neither of my two societies accept me. It allows me a totally unbiased look at the whole race relations thing.
I hear white people complain about pressure on them not to be racist, and how they aren't allowed any personal pride.

First of all, white people have plenty of personal pride. The basis of UK and US culture is entirely about white pride. The economics, the religion, the entertainment fields, all created to and a homage to the white race. But in all the self glorification those afforementioned complainers don't see that, out of jealousy of the level of pride the other races and cultures have. The fact is white people killed their own culture long ago, complaining wont bring it back. That's why I laugh when people around here speak of France as being "cultural". For a white country it certainly is, i'll tell you that.

Second of all, white people would not get so much flak over racism if they weren't historically the most racist of any race to occupy the planet. Does this mean you should be punished for it? No. But you can't expect the whole world to trust your race just like that. It will take time, and it doesn't help that there are still so many openly racist people around, as well as the discreet racists.

I want to make it clear that the behavior of all races angers me, not the least my two own races. Maybe it's just the west, but around here it seems racial pride has become entirely cosmetic. I respect ANY race or culture that has a true respect for their own heritage, and I don't know much about Native American culture, but it certainly looks like it does just that.

[Laz]

Originally Posted by Daewoodrow

But you can't expect the whole world to trust your race just like that.

Yeah, that's right. Distrusting an entire race based on the actions of some people of said race is the way we can beat racism!

[garland81]

I think we need a group hug now.