ROTT Online

[oak man]

Is there any possible way to play rott online? I have winrott but I don't wanno use its methods of online gamming. thanks for your help.

[jbailey]

As far as I know, winrott is the only version of rott that supports internet
(tcp/ip) play. The original version only did local networks...

[avatar_58]

From what I've tried of ROTT multiplayer its really not that great Might have something to do with the super powered weapons and ease of aim.

[Little Conqueror]

It takes a while to get used to. It can be quite fun.

[Iron_Man]

It is entirely too bad that WinROTT's gameplay is nothing like the original. It has an entirely different feel. (IMO) I wish there was a way to play the original DOS ROTT online . I remember back in the day playing over IPX, and god was it fun.

Long live the dopefish!

[jbailey]

I'm sorry you feel that way, but myself & birger did the best we could to
update the game in general and try to maintain the original feel of the game.
Here's what we did mainly:


Get the game running nativly for windows xp (not easy).

Add hi-res video modes.

Fix most of the bugs remaining from the last released original version of rott
(1.3 I think).

Incorporate some type of tcp/ip net play, it works, but it needs a bit more
work.

Bring the audio playback up to date, by re-writing it to use direct-sound.

I would like to see opengl, not done yet, but started at least by birger..


There is a number of other things, but this represents most of the major
stuff.

Everything considered, I'd say winrott is a *very* close approximation of
the original game, plus enhancments. If you think this is easy, try it your-
self sometime.

[Iron_Man]

I never said it was easy - and I completely respect the fact that you guys wrote it. I just don't think it has the same feel for some reason. I honestly don't know what it is, but it just isn't the same. I do have to admit though, playing ROTT at 1024x768 is pretty damn cool. I am not here to disrespect anyone, I am just stating that the gameplay isn't the same. I am actually thrilled that someone created a Windows port, that takes a lot of work, and I understand that completely. I apologize if I offended anyone.

[jbailey]

No offense taken, I was just making a point...

[Iron_Man]

I was just messing around with WinROTT again today, and it has improved by leaps and bounds since the last version I used. Also, playing at 320x200 makes the game feel almost identical to the original. I spoke too soon, should have tried the newest version (at ROTT's native res) before I opened my big mouth. My bad. Now all I need to do is try the TCP/IP feature.

[jbailey]

Glad your enjoying winrott! have fun!

hallo jbailey :

Could you please send me those ( files/directories source code ) to
[email protected], I would really aprecciate this.

why I want those files ?, I want to work on wh port.

>>I would like to get the following directories:

>>e:\whaven\run
>>e:\whaven2\src\mplayer
>>e:\whaven2\src\gcl520h

>>And even though I don't see a reference to it, if it's available,
>>I'd like to get the mpsdk referred to in the sources.

>>Sir lemon quoted: Thats just mplayer and gcl520h files...i'll ask
>>him for the others.

jbailey did you make any progress over wh src port ?

PD: I have AAA experience over C++.

I will share any leap into wh porting src.

Witch Haven is an awe inspiring game.

Thanks.
- AlienGreys.

[jbailey]

Umm, does anyone here know what the official status of the WH source code
is? Has it been publically released or not?....

Thanks!

[TerminX]

Originally Posted by jbailey

Umm, does anyone here know what the official status of the WH source code
is? Has it been publically released or not?....

Thanks!

As far as I know, there is no "official" status because there supposedly isn't a company that "officially" owns it anymore. Basically, someone claiming to know the original programmer posted the code on a forum and on a website one day with the intention of people doing something with it.

However, the guy who ended up with the source was apparently a bit of an ass, because he also claimed to have the Witchaven 2 and TekWar source as well, but then told people they had to do something with the source to the original Witchaven before he would give them the code to WH2 and TekWar. Sometime shortly thereafter he removed the links to the file and AFAIK nobody really heard anything about it again.

[Joe Siegler]

As far as I know, there is no "official" status because there supposedly isn't a company that "officially" owns it anymore. Basically, someone claiming to know the original programmer posted the code on a forum and on a website one day with the intention of people doing something with it.

Well, one of the Witchhaven developers works here at 3DR, and has for a very long time, that being Ruben Cabrera. I've asked him a few times, and he doesn't seem like he has any special insight into this, though.

Keep in mind someone somewhere owns the rights. It may not be obvious, but SOMEONE does unless it's been specifically released into freeware or PD. I know that sticks in the craw of the Abandonware (aka pirate) folks, but it is the way these things work, like it or not.

Duke Manhattan Project is a good example of that. Arush got bought out by a larger company (forget who at the moment). The parent company went belly up, and took Arush down with 'em. DNMP is now the legal property of a court appointed holding company involved in the bankruptcy proceedings of the parent company whose name I can't remember.

Scott & I tried to contact them about either getting the rights back so we could sell it ourselves, or just releasing it as freeware. Unfortunately, said company "isn't intersted in dealing with us", per Scott.

So DNMP is in rights hell, unfortunately. I would wager being the folks who "are" Duke Nukem, we could probably fight that and get the rights back, but it wouldn't be worth it, really. A lot of court costs just to release a game as freeware, or sell it when it didn't sell much in the first place.

[TerminX]

Neat. I've e-mailed the original programmer about it (who is also the guy the source allegedly came from), so we'll see if he can shed some light onto the subject.

[jbailey]

Crap! I did some research myself last night trying to find the current
copyright owner to the WH source code, and came back with nothing, Sooo,
I made (the probably stupid) decision to send this guy:

[email protected]

what extra WH source code I had, I just tried compiling the WH code for
the first time, and I'm missing some header files, so what I have is
incomplete anyway and therefore useless unless the missing code can be
found or re-written. So, what does everyone think? Am I in hot water now
or what? Please keep in mind that had I found the current copyright
holders to WH source code I wouldn't have sent it to anyone without
first asking the appropriate people. Too late now though....

[TerminX]

I would seriously not worry about being in trouble for that. I just got word back from the programmer, Les Bird, and he states the following:

I have no idea what the status is of the Witchaven, Witchaven II or Tekwar games and source code. I do not own it and I do not know who owns it. As a former programmer at Capstone the code was in my possession and I gave it out in hopes that it would somehow be revived in the hobbyist community.

If I had to guess, I'd say it's probably owned by one of the people that had a bigger hand in Capstone, or maybe by someone who possibly purchased the rights when the company went under (or whatever happened). No matter who owns it, nothing can legally be done with the source code until they've been found and contacted about the matter.

[jbailey]

Thanks! I feel a little better now. If Les Bird has already given out the
source code to WH, then the full source package should be available
somewhere, but if nobody knows where, then could I get les's email so I
can ask him personally?

[TerminX]

I'm not sure that he wants people bothering him about it, but I found his e-mail by simply Googling for "Les Bird". If you can't find a copy of it, I think I still have the archive around here somewhere. As far as I'm concerned, if nobody knows who actually owns the code and if the guy who coded the thing doesn't mind people having a copy of it, there isn't anything wrong with letting people satisfy their curiosity. It would be nice to find whomever owns the code and see about getting a proper release so that something can actually be done with it, but I doubt it'll ever happen.

[jbailey]

All I have is a partial copy of the WH code, if you have the complete sources, that'd be great! I'll look up les's email...

Thanks!

[avatar_58]

Originally Posted by Joe Siegler

I know that sticks in the craw of the Abandonware (aka pirate) folks

I'd retort, but we all know where this thread would end up.

[jbailey]

I just got this back from les bird a few minutes ago:

Johnathan, I'll put the code up for download sometime this weekend.

Good news! I assume he means the code will be up for download on his
site at www.lesbird.com sometime during the weekend...

[jbailey]

This just up:



CAPSTONE GAMES SOURCE ARCHIVE

The following files are provided as-is with no guarantee that they'll compile and build proper executables.
The compiler used to build the code was Watcom C/C++ V9.5 or later.
The target system was a 486 50+mhz running MS-DOS V5 or higher.

These games were released by Capstone Software prior to them folding in 1996. As a former Capstone programmer this code was found in my archives and by popular demand I've decided to release it to the hobbyist community in hopes that the games will be revived. I do not own this code and I do not know who owns the copyrights to these games. To the best of my knowledge these games are abandonware (or whatever you want to call it).

Please note that these archives are snapshots of the development folder. Some files are not actually used in the retail version of the game.

Witchaven I source and executables (14 mb) - WHAVEN.ZIP

Witchaven II source and executables (39 mb) - WHAVEN2.ZIP

Tekwar source and executables (15 mb) - TEKWAR.ZIP

Notice: It has been reported to me that there are viruses in 2 files. DAPI.DOC and DAPI.ZIP. Please clean them with virus scanning software before opening them.

--------------------------

Here's the link:

http://www.lesbird.com/CAPSTONE/default.htm

[TerminX]

VERY cool. Legal issues aside, due to my work with Duke and Build, I absolutely love seeing the source to other Build games.

Thanks, Les!

[jbailey]

I've been playing around with the sources, and at the moment, there are 2
issues:

1. The file 'mplayer.h' is still missing

2. There are references to 'hi-res' versions of some tiles that do not seem
to exist in 'names.h', a quick fix (not really a fix though) would be to
rename the tile names that don't exist to the closest ones that do.

As it stands right now, the 2nd problem isn't that bad, but the 1st one
can only be gotten around at the moment by commenting out the code
that references that file, which means no multiplayer in any re-compiled
executables.

[TerminX]

Do any of the other source code archives have mplayer.h? I wouldn't be surprised if there was some shared code. I downloaded the WH2 and TekWar source archives myself but I haven't gotten to digging through them yet. If neither of them have it, you could probably rewrite the header yourself if you're clever and have some understanding of what the code is doing.

[jbailey]

Well, between the WH2 & WH1 code, I was able to piece together a usable
names.h, I'll attach it here, please note that I am *not* sure if it's right or
not, but my changes seem to fix a few errors. I emailed les about the
missing mplayer.h, he's the best candidate for having this file or at least
knowing where to get it, if he doesn't know (or just doesn't respond), a
usable mplayer.h will have to written. The netcode would eventually be
re-written anyway, but I was just wanting to get the code 'as-is' compiling
& running first.

Note that I am running OW 1.6Beta as the compiler...

John

[jbailey]

Oops! I almost forgot, there are quite a few '.def' files in the source dir, they
seem to cause problems with the current watcom compiler...

[jbailey]

I just got this from les in regards to mplayer.h:


If I remember correctly that file is part of the MPlayer network SDK. Not sure if they are still around but they were similar to Dwango back then. A network that you can connect to in order to find multiplayer opponents. I'm sure even if they are still around that the code is completely incompatible. I briefly looked at the code and saw that there's a #define MPLAYERCOMPILE. Just comment that out and it should compile with the default IPX networking code.

- Les

[TerminX]

Ohhhh, that MPlayer. Holy shit, that was forever ago. Multiple forevers, even.

[Cheapy]

Mplayer was since acquired by Gamespy around 2000. Chomp. Too bad Wikipedia doesn't mention them at all.

Originally Posted by jbailey

As far as I know, winrott is the only version of rott that supports internet
(tcp/ip) play. The original version only did local networks...

ROTT had modem dial-up COMM-BAT too iirc. It was also supported on KALI.

One on one Into The Fray DMs are tense :O

[jbailey]

I'll have to admit that it's not looking too good for the right mplayer.h to
turn up anytime soon

[TerminX]

Originally Posted by jbailey

I'll have to admit that it's not looking too good for the right mplayer.h to
turn up anytime soon

Why are you frowning? You pasted an e-mail from Les telling you it was worthless even if you did have it. I don't see why you care.

[jbailey]

Now that I actually know what the mplayer was about I don't care about it
that much now, any remaining interest I had was simply for the sake of
completeness, but it's not needed really...