10 ways for 3d realms to possibly mess up with DNF

[twist]

Here are 10 possible ways I think 3DR can mess up with DNF.
Give some feedback.


-Trying too hard to please diehard fans of duke (in terms of duke’s look or the game play style) that it gets in the way of catering to the general public, many of whom have never played a Duke game.

-Releasing the game quickly

-Over hyping the game (or not preventing the hype) to a point where there is no way it could live up to people’s expectations of design, graphical detail, interactivity, etc.

- Not putting breaks in the fast paced run and gun shooting for slower one on one battles, puzzles or just to allow the player to get acquainted with the environments.

-Having George B and only one or two others being behind all the gameplay scripting and tweaks where multifaceted, highly detailed games like Half Life 2 and COD have well over a dozen minds contributing to the finer details of their games.

-stuffing the game with a lot to do but with no purpose in the actual progression of the stages. I think all that effort will just be a waste of time. Compared putting interactivity to use and allowing the player to come up with stuff to go through level in their own way.

-Looking to other successful fps’s like hl2 to emulate instead of being ambitious enough to try to redefine the market standard.

- Not putting enough variation in the individual battles of enemies. Whether it be through bad AI or limited fighting mechanics. Like not being able to make light tactical decisions like choosing whether to fling a grenade, quietly roll it or stuff it in a pig’s mouth.

-Focusing on content rather than well thought out gamplay design elements. Content takes longer and doesn’t really contribute as much to a game’s enjoyability.

--the ego system, atleast call it something else. Duke knows he is badass but isn’t he above getting egotistical for every bug he kills?

[digimonkey]

-Releasing the game quickly

I lol'd

[Stevey Boy]

Originally Posted by twist

-Releasing the game quickly

Quality

[d3ad connection]

All of these, except for the ego system one, can be said about any upcoming FPSs.

And yes, Duke is egotistical.

[Jinroh]

What's with all these how could 3DR mess up or lose money threads?

[Stevey Boy]

Originally Posted by Jinroh

What's with all these how could 3DR mess up or lose money threads?

Thats what im thinking the game will be awesome

[Jinroh]

Originally Posted by Stevey Boy

Thats what im thinking the game will be awesome

Exactly, I don't know what's with all the negative Nancies lately. 3DR will make tons of money and people will buy DNF regardless.

[Stevey Boy]

Originally Posted by Jinroh

Exactly, I don't know what's with all the negative Nancies lately. 3DR will make tons of money and people will buy DNF regardless.

Exactly, Im not gonna go by what a reviewer or someone says about it, Im gonna get it as soon as I can
Itll be amazing, how can it go wrong? Its Duke Nukem FFS

[Jinroh]

My sentiments exactly. I'll buy just because I want one and have been waiting 4Ever lol for it.

Originally Posted by twist

-Trying too hard to please diehard fans of duke (in terms of duke’s look or the game play style) that it gets in the way of catering to the general public, many of whom have never played a Duke game.

If no one else knows Duke, then pleasing the fans won't harm anyone. As whatever experience we (the fans) get, it will be new for everyone else anyway.

Originally Posted by twist

-Releasing the game quickly

You're not being serious, are you?

Originally Posted by twist

-Over hyping the game (or not preventing the hype) to a point where there is no way it could live up to people’s expectations of design, graphical detail, interactivity, etc.

I think the Jace Hall Footage managed to bring down the hype to non-hazardous levels.

Originally Posted by twist

- Not putting breaks in the fast paced run and gun shooting for slower one on one battles, puzzles or just to allow the player to get acquainted with the environments.

I think we will get calm moments, 3DR didn't place all that interactivity just to make us fight all the time. I don't know where I remember this but I think someone from 3DR said that the prime aspect of DNF will be it's interactivity. Like "the combat is what you do in between all the interactivity"

Originally Posted by twist

-Having George B and only one or two others being behind all the gameplay scripting and tweaks where multifaceted, highly detailed games like Half Life 2 and COD have well over a dozen minds contributing to the finer details of their games.

Gameplay scripting and tweaks are made by the level designers , programmers, etc. I think you're talking about the ideas, right? Don't worry, they had 12 years to come up with as many ideas as possible. I can only hope that none of the ridiculous ideas from forumers come to life though.

Originally Posted by twist

-stuffing the game with a lot to do but with no purpose in the actual progression of the stages. I think all that effort will just be a waste of time. Compared putting interactivity to use and allowing the player to come up with stuff to go through level in their own way.

That's something any company can screw up, and it's one of the things you have to consider yourself when you're already playing the game.

Originally Posted by twist

-Looking to other successful fps’s like hl2 to emulate instead of being ambitious enough to try to redefine the market standard.

I think that spending 12 years to perfect your game is a clear indication that you want to make the best game possible.
I think Duke with all it's interactivity will have it's own place at the peak of games.
Let's hope they ditch the Snotty blob insect type of weapons like prey. Man WHERE THOSE WEAPONS WEAK.

Originally Posted by twist

- Not putting enough variation in the individual battles of enemies. Whether it be through bad AI or limited fighting mechanics. Like not being able to make light tactical decisions like choosing whether to fling a grenade, quietly roll it or stuff it in a pig’s mouth.

Forget about stuffing a grenade on a pigcop or you're heading for dissapointment.

Originally Posted by twist

-Focusing on content rather than well thought out gamplay design elements. Content takes longer and doesn’t really contribute as much to a game’s enjoyability.

I hope you don't mean that the game can be short if it's quality. Please no...after 12 years I MUST have quality AND quantity.

Originally Posted by twist

--the ego system, atleast call it something else. Duke knows he is badass but isn’t he above getting egotistical for every bug he kills?

I also don't like the Ego system but apparently it won't even make it to the game as it was for "Testing" but the question is...to test what? an ego system?

[mysteryperfecta]

Its a good list. Some of the points are not at all likely, but a couple are possible.

*There are many of us who have argued for quality over quantity when it comes to interactivity (i.e. meaningful over mindless interactivity).

*Also important to some of us is that the gameplay drives the story, rather than relegating story progression to NPC exposition and direction ("Go and do this", "This happened, now this needs to happen", etc).

*I've wondered (in a completely unfounded and speculative way) how rigid GB's overall vision for the game is. Has that led to delays and departures?

*There have been certain games that have changed the FPS landscape since 3dr began development on DNF, and I'd be surprised if that hadn't affected the game. It will be interesting to see how much DNF leads vs. how much DNF follows.

*Pacing is incredibly important. A fast pace is accentuated by a slower pace; loud and soft provide contrast and variation.

*I don't see a problem in catering to die-hard Duke fans (of which I am not). Duke wasn't exactly a niche title; it had a broad appeal.

*That's an interesting, albeit picky, point about the ego system. Perhaps it would be solved by making the system (the details of which are sketchy) invisible.

[alexgk]

In the videogame industry there are a million ways to mess up the release of a game...

[jet jaguar 2.0]

Console-centric UI.

Release for consoles BEFORE pc(i.e. MS waves a wad of cash for 6 month Xbox360 exclusivity).

Anything below an 'M' rating.

Water that does nothing special. You've boasted about the water doing something special so it better do more than looking like shimmering jello!

Game is too short. 6-8 hours on normal setting would be an epic fail.

Anything below an 'M' rating.

[fast-1]

I wonder why with all these tweaks if the game would be something of an enigma.

1. If the game is going to be great and need great system requirements then they should make it without trying to please all people here or it will take years to make.

If there are working on it then it should not mess up.

[SWAT guy]

- Making it Vista-only (no XP support).
- Mandatory internet connection to install or play the game (STEAM-like crap).

[peoplessi]

Originally Posted by SWAT guy

- Making it Vista-only (no XP support).

Not going to happen with the current installbase. Just not a viable option for them, if they are in this for money.

Originally Posted by SWAT guy

- Mandatory internet connection to install or play the game (STEAM-like crap).

Steam discussion doesn't belong here, but Steam is far from being crap. Reliable cheat detection, and content management, everything accessible easily. Closest thing to Xbox Live on PC. Mandatory internet connection, well, if that means less piracy, then sure. Like with BioShock. If it just works, but good multiplayer with cdkey check will keep pirates at bay too.

[KO Gilligan]

Originally Posted by peoplessi

Not going to happen with the current installbase. Just not a viable option for them, if they are in this for money.



Steam discussion doesn't belong here, but Steam is far from being crap. Reliable cheat detection, and content management, everything accessible easily. Closest thing to Xbox Live on PC. Mandatory internet connection, well, if that means less piracy, then sure. Like with BioShock. If it just works, but good multiplayer with cdkey check will keep pirates at bay too.

Meh...I wish Steam discussion belonged here, I hate to wander off and rant about a post from somewhere else. I was an expert at bashing Steam some time ago...They have since done other things to ease my grief. But if DNF is content protected for number of installs or a single account we will never have second hand games. As long as it's only running in one PC what's with all the grief? The mass pirating overseaes is killing the game makers, not game traders. My latest MS operating system is second hand.... like I said - 1 license - 1 PC.

[LeadBullet]

- Listening to most of the fan "ideas" posted in this forum.

[Minty]

Originally Posted by Jinroh

What's with all these how could 3DR mess up or lose money threads?

I think people have ran out of things to talk about.

[clayasaurus]

1 way for 3drealms to mess up : by not shipping a good game.

3D Realms know probably better then most what makes a good game.

Their visions for what makes a good game are probably so far ahead of their time, that they have to wait to ship their games to prevent a rip in the space time continuum.

[hightreason]

Hmm, I reckon it'll be a good game, as has been said 3D Realms knows what a good game is, and how to make it so.

Even if it sucked, i'd buy it anyway just to see it - the only "Forever" joke i could use is that i am happy to wait forever and will do if i have to - which isn't really a joke, it's a statement. But seriously, i reckon it'll be great. I mean, Halo sold and that sucks, so a great quality game like DNF will have no problem selling at all.

What is worth remembering is that Duke 3D had an odd creation, it started all punky (lameduke) and then they pulled it all together in about a year (v1.3D) - I reckon DNF is a similar story (it changed).

[Tim. Just Tim.]

10 ways they could mess up with DNF:

- not releasing in 2008
- not releasing in 2009
- not releasing in 2010
- not releasing in 2011
- not releasing in 2012
- not releasing in 2013
- not releasing in 2014
- not releasing in 2015
- not releasing in 2016
- not releasing in 2017

[Usurper]

First post sounds like one of those a-hole corporate consultants that companies hire to tell them ingenious shit like

1. We need to innovate and think outside the box
2. Customer service is key
and my favorite
3. We need to work together as a team

[Minty]

Originally Posted by Usurper

First post sounds like one of those a-hole corporate consultants that companies hire to tell them ingenious shit like

1. We need to innovate and think outside the box
2. Customer service is key
and my favorite
3. We need to work together as a team

EA could do with one of them.

[Texetera]

Originally Posted by Tim. Just Tim.

10 ways they could mess up with DNF:

- not releasing in 2008
- not releasing in 2009
- not releasing in 2010
- not releasing in 2011
- not releasing in 2012
- not releasing in 2013
- not releasing in 2014
- not releasing in 2015
- not releasing in 2016
- not releasing in 2017

Woo hoo, an early 2018 release. Can't wait!

[mysteryperfecta]

Originally Posted by LeadBullet

- Listening to most of the fan "ideas" posted in this forum.

My ideas have been great-- I've stolen them from very smart people.

[crunchy superman]

Originally Posted by Usurper

First post sounds like one of those a-hole corporate consultants that companies hire to tell them ingenious shit like

1. We need to innovate and think outside the box
2. Customer service is key
and my favorite
3. We need to work together as a team

Originally Posted by Minty

EA could do with one of them.

[Mr Bear]

Originally Posted by jet jaguar 2.0

Console-centric UI.

GB has stressed many, many, MANY, times that Duke is being built with the PC first and foremost in mind. Nothing AT ALL to worry about there, imo.

Release for consoles BEFORE pc(i.e. MS waves a wad of cash for 6 month Xbox360 exclusivity).

I don't think even MS could afford an offer like that, at least one that 3DR would even begin to consider.....

Anything below an 'M' rating.

eC Duke, ftw!!

Water that does nothing special. You've boasted about the water doing something special so it better do more than looking like shimmering jello!

GB says it does "stuff." Very vague, yet somehow enough has been said.

Game is too short. 6-8 hours on normal setting would be an epic fail.

No, it would be a fail on 3DR's behalf (sorry).

[twist]

Originally Posted by timothy2

I hope you don't mean that the game can be short if it's quality. Please no...after 12 years I MUST have quality AND quantity.

That is one problem they cant help at all. Its kind of sad really. Everybody is expecting a game that justifies a 12 year development cycle but the fact is the current DNF version's development length is about the same as other shooters. 3d realms' small team isnt helping either.

How are they going to compete with other developers that are trying just as hard? It's not like they have any upperhand at all. I'm not expecting gold from DNF but i really do hope they will surprise us all.

[DeadlygothRacer]

Originally Posted by twist

-Trying too hard to please diehard fans of duke (in terms of duke’s look or the game play style) that it gets in the way of catering to the general public, many of whom have never played a Duke game.

That's not going to be relatively hard considering we all know what Duke Nukem is about. Now, if they started to use Manhattan Project and Zero Hour as a reference to this game, then I'd be worried. Lets face it, all the duke games (except probably Duke 64) was not quite the same after Duke3D.

As for the length of the FPS genre, the games would be great if it occupied me for 2 weeks at most, but lets face it most FPS last about a week and a half at best. that's just the genre. any longer it's probably become stale and repetitive...depending. I never get tired of duke really, just wish he had some hilarious lines he could spout out that I could repeat and actually be funny

Originally Posted by twist

Anything below an 'M' rating.

Sadly, I'd never buy a Duke Nukem game that had a T or Below rating. because Duke does not need censorship. I think George knows this. Besides duke isn't duke without a Mature rating.

[razgriz]

Originally Posted by DeadlygothRacer

Sadly, I'd never buy a Duke Nukem game that had a T or Below rating. because Duke does not need censorship. I think George knows this. Besides duke isn't duke without a Mature rating.

Same here!

Anyway, I hope 3DRealms doesn't give into the soccer moms or the politicians who hate good entertainment.

Censorship is bad.

[Nessus]

" -Having George B and only one or two others being behind all the gameplay scripting and tweaks where multifaceted, highly detailed games like Half Life 2 and COD have well over a dozen minds contributing to the finer details of their games."

To me that's a reason it should be successful. So far every game George has been involved has excellent gameplay.

[Razorback]

Not to mention that GB and 3DR don't live in a cage. They know good an well what game makers are producing these days and how DNF will compare. I expect a damn good game, when it will arrive is the question mark!

I think they do keep Joe in a cage though!

[anomix]

The only factor I fear Is, and without making too much of an assumption, If the game doesnt get released soon, will the Engine and Interactivity fall behind? Because as a poster above mentioned their are plenty of other developers our there all working on the "next" thing.

[hightreason]

You don't need a next generation engine, you'd be amazed what you can do to an ageing one, but for hardcore gamers, they don't care when "it's gotta be the latest thing" - for me it'll be gameplay, not age of the engine.

I reckon the way they could screw it up for me (it's taken some thought) is to not have a keyboard only control, i can't use the mouse (I'm left hamded too, making it worse) and prefer keyboard only control.

[hightreason]

I mean, in terms of outdated engines, look how long the quake engine was about "I ain't affraid of no quake ", they just tweaked for years, the DNF engine obviously changed at some point and it could be a similar story - i think it's already old anyway you see.

"I aint afraid of no half-life, quake 2, quake 3, quake 4, doom 3, halflife2, episode 1,2,3, crysis, fear, fear 2, condemned, condemned 2, blood2, shogo, farcry, farcry2, sin, sin episodes, deus ex, deus ex 2...ahh f*ck it"

[Drazula]

Originally Posted by mysteryperfecta

My ideas have been great-- I've stolen them from very smart people.

Thank you!

Ways to mess up DNF:

- Leave out the Dopefish.
- Give Duke a cell phone.
- End DNF with "To be continued..."

[trucedAnimal]

Another ways to mess up DNF:
Too much dialogue

I just love how you can play DN3D für hours and find so much stuff, explore buildings, find secret places, see things you know from movies, experience lots or interactivity and dont have to talk to one person.

I just love that "last man on earth" setting of DN3D. I also love those movies. Some other fans might like some more interactivity with NPCs but I'd just hit "escape" to get back to the ass kicking.

[JobivanHiob]

the only thread aktive at the moment is this one and I hate this thread!
Nothing to talk about....we need new media. Hear us 3D Realms.